5 3 1 Military press

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  • #10871

    migraine22
    Participant

    So I'm on my third cycle of 5 3 1 and all my lifts are progressing except my military press.  Strength just doesn't want to improve.  I'm assuming I may have started my 1 max rep too high and am paying the price for it.  Also i have some rotator cuff issues that aren't helping out the situation.  Any suggestions?

    #215487

    Richard Schmitt
    Moderator

    I would lower your TM and do some mobility work.

    #215488

    migraine22
    Participant

    Thanks, tex.  That's what I was figuring.

    #215489

    Bradley R. Collins
    Participant

    I read an article Jim Wendler wrote for T-Nation (I'm too lazy to sift through them for the link, haha) where he went through a phase where he took the shoulder press out as a main lift, and moved it to an accessory lift for 5×10 after bench press.  He started light and increased his poundage over time as long as he could get 5×10 with a given weight, he'd add 5 more lbs next time.  Doing this not only did his shoulder press go up when he went back to using it as a main pressing lift, but his bench press increased, too.I've been experimenting with this protocol myself over the last few months.  I started light with 115 lbs and only increased by 2.5 lbs each session.  Today was my last one (I did 150 lbs for 5x10, which was actually pretty damn hard) and next week I'll add it back in as a main lift.  I guess I'll see if Jim Wendler's advice works for me.

    #215486

    TCB
    Participant

    Could also try a linear progression deal, like what Greyskull uses. Start light, one day do sets of 5,5,5+ .. On that last set if you can do more than 10, you went too light, so increase 5/10lb for next workout. If you do less than 5, you went too heavy, reset. On another day do 4×8, 3×10, etc. Could help to break the plateau.

    #215490

    migraine22
    Participant

    Ace,  what are you replacing the MP with as a main lift?I may try that first and if no progress, go with TCBs suggestion.

    #215491

    Brandon D Christ
    Participant

    Military Press is the toughest lift to increase because it uses small muscles.  Bench press will be the next lift that will stall for the same reasons.You have a couple options.  You can turn the training max back down like what the other guys said, or you can switch exercises for a few weeks.  Maybe do seated presses, behind the neck presses, change grip widths, half presses, push presses, ect.

    #215492

    Bradley R. Collins
    Participant

    Military Press is the toughest lift to increase because it uses small muscles.  Bench press will be the next lift that will stall for the same reasons.You have a couple options.  You can turn the training max back down like what the other guys said, or you can switch exercises for a few weeks.  Maybe do seated presses, behind the neck presses, change grip widths, half presses, push presses, ect.

    I used dips and bench presses as my main pressing lifts, then afterward both bench press and dips I would do 5x10 standing barbell overhead press.  I did that for 8 weeks. 

    #215493

    migraine22
    Participant

    awesome. Thanks for the suggestions.  Will try keeping MP in the rotation but lowering the training max like Tex suggested and try to alter grips maybe use behind the neck presses to start. If that doesn't help, I'll go Ace's route. Hell maybe a combo of both and throw in 5×10 at 40% TM on BP day.  Thanks again for the help.

    #215494

    Bmb013
    Participant

    Most people seem to stall out on their military press pretty quickly.  I was always one of those people when I ran 5/3/1 or similar low frequency, lower volume programs.It wasn't until I got into doing some kettlebell training than I understood why.  If you guys are not familiar with Pavel Tsatsouline you should get familiar with him.  Many people peg him as "the kettlebell guy" and miss out on a wealth of training info.  He is extremely knowledgable about everything strength related. He is very well connected and respected in the powerlifting community.Anyway, back to the military press.  Pavel have written about research by the Russians conducted back when the military press was still an Olympic events.  Their research showed that the military press needs to be trained with a large weekly training volume. I believe that the ideal volume was 75-100 reps per week.  I assume that this does not include warmup/ ramp up reps.  The Russian usually spit this volume into 3 weekly press workouts.As you can see standard 5/3/1 doesn't touch this kind of volume, and adding something like 5 x 10 is not enough weight to really drive up your press.  To really drive your military press I would train it at least twice a week and add volume with back off sets of 3-5 repsThis is the book with a section on training the military press. The Kindle version is $5.99.http://www.amazon.com/Power-People-Professional-Deadlift-Techniques-ebook/dp/B00IEVEJIG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1395243651&sr=8-1&keywords=power+to+the+people+professional

    #215495

    migraine22
    Participant

    So what you are suggesting would be something like 5 3 1 boring but big for MP and then add 4 or 5 sets of 10 on BP day as accessory?

    #215496

    Brandon D Christ
    Participant

    So what you are suggesting would be something like 5 3 1 boring but big for MP and then add 4 or 5 sets of 10 on BP day as accessory?

    I think what BmB means is that you should do something like a 5x5 three times per week in the military press.  That could be an option as well.  I do think you can easily train military press (or bench press) three times per week.If it were me though, I would just do what you mentioned.  I think doing sets of 10 will really be beneficial. 

    #215497

    migraine22
    Participant

    Opted to go MP boring but big with seated behind the neck presses.  Much more comfortable on my shoulder and able to press out more reps without having to stop before reaching goal number.  Going to throw in 4 or 5 accessory sets on BP day as I mentioned earlier and see where this takes me for a few 4 week cycles.

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5 3 1 Military press

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