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So with that being said Mr. Jiggy, if I weigh 180 at around 17-18% and am doing the 10 day CNS before starting CBL would a good diet look like this?Fat 130: Protein 130: Carbs 30 or less?this calculates out to 1170k/c fat; 520k/c pro; 120k/c carbs; = 1790k/c total for the daythis comes out roughly to 65% fat or more depending on how much carbs I consume, and comes is at around a 20%+/- deficit below my maintence of 2300-2400k/c per day which I have observed for past month.
Well to start, if you're going for CBL, it's not exactly a 10 day CNS, because you are not having an all-out Carb Nite binge on the 10th day -- you're instead having a carb backload starting after your lifting session that day. The main differences are that we DO keep track of our carb intake (based more or less off of the amount of weight lost during the 10 day prep matched to the chart in the back of the book) and we also keep the backload confined to a few hours post workout, rather than spread over the course of 5-6 hours on a regular Carb Nite.That being said, a good place to start would be to either calculate your lean body mass and match your protein/fats to that number OR go by your target weight. So if you weigh 180 and you perhaps want to get down to, lets say, 165, you would want to consume roughly 165g of both protein and fat by day's end. You don't want to drop your overall intake down too low because that can cause your body to slow your metabolism down to the point where you are not effectively burning the fat you are taking in because your body is trying to hold on to everything you put into it.And the carb limit is set at 30g, yes, but you really want to keep that number as close to 0 as possible. And you also really don't want to go over maybe 10g per meal, because there is the chance that could spike insulin. The 30 is mainly just there as a buffer.
Thank you!!! I think based on your recommendations I will use my LBM which is roughly 150lbs to set my macros at 150fat: 150pro, which puts me at 1g/per lb of LBM and 1950k/c per day is which is about 450 less than my observed maintence.One other question, if I was doing CNS exclusively would the above numbers be the same as for the low carb days on CBL and vice versa?I really appreciate the info.
One more thing to try and help out. The weight you're trying to shoot for which is 150g, subtract the amount of whey protein you'll be taking in the PWO Shake. That's if you're training. Say you want to have 30g of protein in your PWO Shake. So you'll shoot for 120g in protein for your whole meals as match it with fat. By the end of the day you should hit 1:1 in grams for fat and protein. I really hope I didn't confuse you at all. If I did please let me know. Have fun and good luck!Mr Jiggy thanks for the great info! As to you Trevor!
Really? Had to use the word "Nazi" huh? Must be pretty damn proud of yourself to use that word huh? How about you actually take the time and listen to the podcasts and the articles that Kiefer took time in writing? Just like what Trevor said, quit being an ass and what Mr Jiggy said calm down.
Actually, he never used the word "Nazi," just compared people here talking about the 1:1 ratio to the Germans who followed the propaganda of Joseph Goebbels, which is a bit melodramatic (and not too accurate either). And he apologized - the reference he made aside I can understand paying $100 for books and being a bit frustrated when you don't get the answer you receive. I think this is a lesson of the necessity of reading more than one source, and cross-checking what you read in books like CNS and CBL with the forums here, with blogs, and with the works of other scholars (some of who'd say that you don't even need that much protein compared to fat).
Really? Had to use the word "Nazi" huh? Must be pretty damn proud of yourself to use that word huh? How about you actually take the time and listen to the podcasts and the articles that Kiefer took time in writing? Just like what Trevor said, quit being an ass and what Mr Jiggy said calm down.
Actually, he never used the word "Nazi," just compared people here talking about the 1:1 ratio to the Germans who followed the propaganda of Joseph Goebbels, which is a bit melodramatic (and not too accurate either). And he apologized - the reference he made aside I can understand paying $100 for books and being a bit frustrated when you don't get the answer you receive. I think this is a lesson of the necessity of reading more than one source, and cross-checking what you read in books like CNS and CBL with the forums here, with blogs, and with the works of other scholars (some of who'd say that you don't even need that much protein compared to fat).
Ok I smell and call bull*** seriously going back and "removing" the post and then stating that "he" didn't say that?...come on? There was no apology either. The only post TheGreyWolf was the one I quoted, because nothing was "removed". There is plenty of information in the books, along with updated articles, podcasts and forums to understand how to properly use CBL or CNS. Besides who's "he"? Isn't "you"?
Haha, Tex – the offending material was removed by shokat or a moderator before you got to the thread. You quoted my calling out of shokat for comparing Fairy to a Nazi supporter, which is what he apologized for a few posts back. I agree with that Argumentum ad Hitlerum has no place on this forum, so please don't blame me for sticking up for a fellow member.
Haha, Tex - the offending material was removed by shokat or a moderator before you got to the thread. You quoted my calling out of shokat for comparing Fairy to a Nazi supporter, which is what he apologized for a few posts back. I agree with that Argumentum ad Hitlerum has no place on this forum, so please don't blame me for sticking up for a fellow member.
*face palm* seriously?...see what happens when I'm driving all day and I miss the events that take place...F***! I do apologize to you. I am truly sorry. I did not mean an offense to you at all. As you can tell, I was completely out of the loop. My mistake entirely.
No harm, no foul man. I mostly just read the posts here and its obvious you're a dedicated poster and a really helpful dude. Given how much work you do here things occasionally happen. I am curious, though, whether people have been able to put on lean mass during ULC days with a really high fat:protein ratio (like a 1.75 or 2 to 1).
Really? Had to use the word "Nazi" huh? Must be pretty damn proud of yourself to use that word huh? How about you actually take the time and listen to the podcasts and the articles that Kiefer took time in writing? Just like what Trevor said, quit being an ass and what Mr Jiggy said calm down.
Actually, he never used the word "Nazi," just compared people here talking about the 1:1 ratio to the Germans who followed the propaganda of Joseph Goebbels, which is a bit melodramatic (and not too accurate either). And he apologized - the reference he made aside I can understand paying $100 for books and being a bit frustrated when you don't get the answer you receive. I think this is a lesson of the necessity of reading more than one source, and cross-checking what you read in books like CNS and CBL with the forums here, with blogs, and with the works of other scholars (some of who'd say that you don't even need that much protein compared to fat).
Ok I smell and call bull*** seriously going back and "removing" the post and then stating that "he" didn't say that?...come on? There was no apology either. The only post TheGreyWolf was the one I quoted, because nothing was "removed". There is plenty of information in the books, along with updated articles, podcasts and forums to understand how to properly use CBL or CNS. Besides who's "he"? Isn't "you"?
I removed the post because I felt it was unhelpful to my original question. But to clear up the matter, I never was comparing anyone to a Nazi, nor did I use the word Nazi. What I said was "if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes the truth." Which was a famous quote from Josef Goebbels. The point I was trying to make was I just finished the ebook and the CNS book within the last week. After having spent $100 and several hours diligently reading and taking notes to start my program I thought i would have a pretty good understanding of how to implement. Then I start hearing about this 1:1 ratio and am perplexed. As hard as I try to find the info on the site I cannot find any posts. And given the fact that I just found these books and this site within the last week I don't have time to listen to 20 or so podcasts. So my next assumption was that maybe this 1:1 ratio is a mistake being repeated on the forum, hence my statement above. I would have loved such an important piece of information to have been more readily available then just having to find it by chance, especially after having bought and read the two books which are the cornerstone of this whole site.So the conclusion that was forced to draw before others referenced the specifics, like the most recent Power article, is that maybe someone made a mistake interpreting Kiefers recommendations, because, if you read CNS all the meal plans look like they could be interpreted as a 1:1 ratio or close to that, if you based it off the calories; e.g. 120g/f, 200g/p, is roughly 1080:800 calories, not 1:1, but I had to draw that assumption based on the lack of other information, so I was figuring maybe someone misread or misheard this ratio as grams versus calories, and it just got repeated over and over. I think my statement taken a little too seriously, when all I was trying to say was maybe somewhere along the line it was misinterpreted. But obviously now we know that is not the case.However, what I will add is that, like me, there is going to probably be a lot of other fairly smart people who will be thrown off by reading CNS and CBL, and without going through 20podcasts and spending 20 hours reading forum posts, who won't have any clue about this 1:1 ratio. I'm just coming from a place where such a critical piece of info is so hard to find without stumbling upon it like I did by accident, and I still was confused and a little frustrated after having read the books and the info was absent.And again I apologize if I came across as antagonistic, not my intention. I really appreciate the help and hope down the road I can help with my feedback of my experience.Thank you everyone for the helpful advice.My only advice to Kiefer is please update the E-book with this 1:1 because that seems be a huge gap in the info presented that could be easily added to any future buyers of the book. As for CNS, maybe you should come out with a 2.0 ebook version with modified meal plans, because I was folllowing the outline from the book for the last week, without knowing about this 1:1, so I was taking in 200protein and 130 fat per day, would have stayed there had I not randomly gotten a correction to a post I made where someone said it was 1:1.
@shokatIt's okay. We forgive you. Nothing wrong with a bit of myth busting
No harm, no foul man. I mostly just read the posts here and its obvious you're a dedicated poster and a really helpful dude. Given how much work you do here things occasionally happen. I am curious, though, whether people have been able to put on lean mass during ULC days with a really high fat:protein ratio (like a 1.75 or 2 to 1).
I have put on a bit of definition when I was on CNS. Nothing major however. Having that much protein won't do the body any good, it basically becomes waste. (Anything above 1.3xBW) What I consider in doing is to start with 1g per LBM for two weeks then increase it every two weeks. So if your LBM is 150lbs, then in two weeks try upping it to 160g. I don't know may work may not.
Really? Had to use the word "Nazi" huh? Must be pretty damn proud of yourself to use that word huh? How about you actually take the time and listen to the podcasts and the articles that Kiefer took time in writing? Just like what Trevor said, quit being an ass and what Mr Jiggy said calm down.
Actually, he never used the word "Nazi," just compared people here talking about the 1:1 ratio to the Germans who followed the propaganda of Joseph Goebbels, which is a bit melodramatic (and not too accurate either). And he apologized - the reference he made aside I can understand paying $100 for books and being a bit frustrated when you don't get the answer you receive. I think this is a lesson of the necessity of reading more than one source, and cross-checking what you read in books like CNS and CBL with the forums here, with blogs, and with the works of other scholars (some of who'd say that you don't even need that much protein compared to fat).
Ok I smell and call bull*** seriously going back and "removing" the post and then stating that "he" didn't say that?...come on? There was no apology either. The only post TheGreyWolf was the one I quoted, because nothing was "removed". There is plenty of information in the books, along with updated articles, podcasts and forums to understand how to properly use CBL or CNS. Besides who's "he"? Isn't "you"?
I removed the post because I felt it was unhelpful to my original question. But to clear up the matter, I never was comparing anyone to a Nazi, nor did I use the word Nazi. What I said was "if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes the truth." Which was a famous quote from Josef Goebbels. The point I was trying to make was I just finished the ebook and the CNS book within the last week. After having spent $100 and several hours diligently reading and taking notes to start my program I thought i would have a pretty good understanding of how to implement. Then I start hearing about this 1:1 ratio and am perplexed. As hard as I try to find the info on the site I cannot find any posts. And given the fact that I just found these books and this site within the last week I don't have time to listen to 20 or so podcasts. So my next assumption was that maybe this 1:1 ratio is a mistake being repeated on the forum, hence my statement above. I would have loved such an important piece of information to have been more readily available then just having to find it by chance, especially after having bought and read the two books which are the cornerstone of this whole site.So the conclusion that was forced to draw before others referenced the specifics, like the most recent Power article, is that maybe someone made a mistake interpreting Kiefers recommendations, because, if you read CNS all the meal plans look like they could be interpreted as a 1:1 ratio or close to that, if you based it off the calories; e.g. 120g/f, 200g/p, is roughly 1080:800 calories, not 1:1, but I had to draw that assumption based on the lack of other information, so I was figuring maybe someone misread or misheard this ratio as grams versus calories, and it just got repeated over and over. I think my statement taken a little too seriously, when all I was trying to say was maybe somewhere along the line it was misinterpreted. But obviously now we know that is not the case.However, what I will add is that, like me, there is going to probably be a lot of other fairly smart people who will be thrown off by reading CNS and CBL, and without going through 20podcasts and spending 20 hours reading forum posts, who won't have any clue about this 1:1 ratio. I'm just coming from a place where such a critical piece of info is so hard to find without stumbling upon it like I did by accident, and I still was confused and a little frustrated after having read the books and the info was absent.And again I apologize if I came across as antagonistic, not my intention. I really appreciate the help and hope down the road I can help with my feedback of my experience.Thank you everyone for the helpful advice.My only advice to Kiefer is please update the E-book with this 1:1 because that seems be a huge gap in the info presented that could be easily added to any future buyers of the book. As for CNS, maybe you should come out with a 2.0 ebook version with modified meal plans, because I was folllowing the outline from the book for the last week, without knowing about this 1:1, so I was taking in 200protein and 130 fat per day, would have stayed there had I not randomly gotten a correction to a post I made where someone said it was 1:1.
When the CBL first came out, there was a lot of trial and errors going on. A lot of confusion...I mean a lot! The book was being pushed to its limit to being published and out to the crowd, so you can probably understand the typos and mis-information in the book. After months of trying to figure out how to utilize the ULC means, CBL meals, timing...finally able to get that precious 1:1 ratio we members so mention so much. However, just like timing and Carb meals, you have to make that ratio work for you as well. More information comes out almost daily and we try to update it on the forums to help benefit everyone else. Plus somethings that were mentioned months ago are pretty much myths or rumors or not helpful to the community. So I apologize as well for the miscommunication. I hope that you do stick around and get more insight on any questions you may have in the near future.Also as you can tell...I don't appreciate people acting ignorant or anything and decide to be an ass. Thus the "defensive" posts.
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