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Opinions, please:I thought I remembered Keifer saying that the principles of CBL may not work for the "already pre-diabetic" and I wonder if the same goes for CNS. He mentioned insulin and it reacting differently in the already-fat person.Should I (50% body fat) check my fasting insulin or my insulin at any other time of day to determine if CNS is going to work for me? If so, what, exactly, would I be looking for in the results? I do have the book and have read it. At the time, I thought I was reading a plan for fat people like me to get lean. I am concerned now that these plans have never been meant to work for the truly obese. Another component:Is a blood ketone meter a useful tool in determining glycogen depletion? I ask all of this because I was ketogenic for a while and when I stopped, I threw away my meter. I am considering purchasing a new one (measures ketones AND carbs). The supplier is having a sale right now... ;DThanks for any and all feedback. -MS
For CNS to work for you since you may be metabolically damaged, you may want to stretch the ULC period to two weeks. Just a thought. I heard Dr. Patel was doing that for his truly obese and metabolically damaged clients. About the meter, though, I am not exactly sure about. On one of his podcasts or interviews, I could have sworn that I heard him say that you don't have to use one, but if you want to, then you can.
Thank you!I did already do the intro phase of only 10 days. 🙁 I think if I feel stalled or otherwise dissatisfied with my progress I will do another stint of 14 days of ULC before my next carb night. I may even keep this current stint of ULC going for 14 days. It depends on how things go on Sunday - a social event, which I was toying with the idea of making my CN. If I decide to keep things LC, I may just push my next CN out another week and see if my results feel any different.Thanks again for the feedback!-MS
I agree, I'm not a doctor nor have the medical background, but after a few recommendations I've heard I do suggest extending the CN window to about once every 2 weeks. Eating PLENTY of FATs and moderate protein. About the meter, I wouldn't think checking it in the mornings, before a meal, after a meal, and evenings during the ULC part of the day just to see where you stand. As well as the actual CN day itself.
Don't quit. Think long term, 6 month cycles with a bit of light CBL in between. Remember CBL is for fit people getting fitter.I believe Kiefer said Carb Nite was mainly written for overweight, middle aged women, who do not exercise. Yes, body fat and hormonal levels operate different in the obese, but please, never let that become an excuse not to stay on it.Everyone can make large improvements, with time.Well, you have to decide how much you want to track and if that will be a stress on you.Tracking is good for troubleshooting, aside from that, it reminds me too much of "dieting". You might find yourself obsessing over details as I have.Some tracking initially might be good to discover just how hard it is to get 60% or 70% fat daily.If you tracked one thing, protein might be a good one. Carb Nite seems a lot higher in protein and seems to contradict Ron Rosedale, Jeff Volek and others. My "guess" is Kiefer wanted more satiation in more people and decided to average higher. I am 215 pounds down from 229 and I eat about 80-110 grams of protein a day.I have seen no loss of strength in 40+ days of CNS. My weight lifting is timed by a stop watch.Don't worry about extending the 10 day start up phase. Kiefer says at most wait 9 days between Carb Nites, so I would try every tenth evening. I have been tempted to do this, but so far I Carb Nite every 7th day.
I agree, I'm not a doctor nor have the medical background, but after a few recommendations I've heard I do suggest extending the CN window to about once every 2 weeks. Eating PLENTY of FATs and moderate protein.
I've done this [delaying CN] with success. Once a week is for convenience/easier and help with cravings and ultimately failing. But you do want that hormonal reboot/benefits from the CN. This site someone posted might be a good tool to try for your Fat:Protein ratio - http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/
I don't know who said it quite yet, but a Facebook post mentioned a quote from someone from a podcast, “You health is your responsibilty.” I say this in addition to what AC said, while once a week is completely for convience and mental stablity, if one is overweight with medical issues on top of that, health would be a priority. In my opinion.
I've done this [delaying CN] with success. Can you describe success?How was it tracked?More weight lost?More fat loss, verified how?
I agree, I'm not a doctor nor have the medical background, but after a few recommendations I've heard I do suggest extending the CN window to about once every 2 weeks. Eating PLENTY of FATs and moderate protein. About the meter, I wouldn't think checking it in the mornings, before a meal, after a meal, and evenings during the ULC part of the day just to see where you stand. As well as the actual CN day itself.
This is encouraging as I have been in "get plenty of fat" mode, but, of course, reading around other peoples' stories of "lower fat" menu selections has made me kind of wonder if CNS had changed/updated since I bought my copy (approx. one year ago). Don't ask me who or where, but a few times around the forum I've seen people stressing about the amount of fat in their hamburger or going with "chicken breasts" to reduce fat.I am now thinking that I have to take everyone else's experiences around here with a grain of salt because, as another poster pointed out, most around here are "fit people working on becoming more fit".Thanks for the encouragement. I appreciate your taking time to reply.
Don't quit. Think long term, 6 month cycles with a bit of light CBL in between. Remember CBL is for fit people getting fitter.I believe Kiefer said Carb Nite was mainly written for overweight, middle aged women, who do not exercise. Yes, body fat and hormonal levels operate different in the obese, but please, never let that become an excuse not to stay on it.Everyone can make large improvements, with time.Well, you have to decide how much you want to track and if that will be a stress on you.Tracking is good for troubleshooting, aside from that, it reminds me too much of "dieting". You might find yourself obsessing over details as I have.Some tracking initially might be good to discover just how hard it is to get 60% or 70% fat daily.If you tracked one thing, protein might be a good one. Carb Nite seems a lot higher in protein and seems to contradict Ron Rosedale, Jeff Volek and others. My "guess" is Kiefer wanted more satiation in more people and decided to average higher. I am 215 pounds down from 229 and I eat about 80-110 grams of protein a day.I have seen no loss of strength in 40+ days of CNS. My weight lifting is timed by a stop watch.Don't worry about extending the 10 day start up phase. Kiefer says at most wait 9 days between Carb Nites, so I would try every tenth evening. I have been tempted to do this, but so far I Carb Nite every 7th day.
I so love this advice. I feel like I just spent a session with a Personal Trainer. Thanks for the pep talk!I love that you say Kiefer wrote the book for middle-aged women who don't exercise. It makes me feel more "at home" with the program than ever before.Thanks again for taking the time to post.
I don't know who said it quite yet, but a Facebook post mentioned a quote from someone from a podcast, "You health is your responsibilty." I say this in addition to what AC said, while once a week is completely for convience and mental stablity, if one is overweight with medical issues on top of that, health would be a priority. In my opinion.
I appreciate the post and the link. I will watch it now. Thank you!EDIT - Ah, it is not a movie. Not sure why I thought it was? Anyway, I am checking your link out right now. Thank you for posting.
I agree, I'm not a doctor nor have the medical background, but after a few recommendations I've heard I do suggest extending the CN window to about once every 2 weeks. Eating PLENTY of FATs and moderate protein.
I've done this [delaying CN] with success. Once a week is for convenience/easier and help with cravings and ultimately failing. But you do want that hormonal reboot/benefits from the CN. This site someone posted might be a good tool to try for your Fat:Protein ratio - http://keto-calculator.ankerl.com/
Holy wow this site is so cool! 😀It is very interesting to review the macros they gave me. I have more or less stopped tracking and only stuck with "tried and true" ULC "recipes" I concocted in my ULC days. I have been eating to satiation, and have only mildly wondered about my calorie intake. What is your opinion about days where my calories might come in UNDER this number? In other words, at what point, exactly, is a deficit of calories (from the right macros) of a detriment to me? In other words, it sure would be a "world has turned upside down" kind of a day when I am stressing about not having eaten ENOUGH food that day...I think I am in danger of derailing my own thread. ::)Thanks for the time you took to respond.-MS
I don't know who said it quite yet, but a Facebook post mentioned a quote from someone from a podcast, "You health is your responsibilty." I say this in addition to what AC said, while once a week is completely for convience and mental stablity, if one is overweight with medical issues on top of that, health would be a priority. In my opinion.
Agreed. Just FYI I am very overweight, but I have no known medical issues. Even the "aches and pains" of old age do not plague me when my diet is corrected (low carb). I do not even type II (yet). In fact, my impetus to lift/eat well is less about being "hawt" and more to stave off Type II, as my Daddy has it and it is quite hereditary Daddy to daughter.Not super relevant to anything other than some background on the ole Mrs. Stash. Thanks for your posts,-MS
I've done this [delaying CN] with success.
Can you describe success?How was it tracked?More weight lost?More fat loss, verified how?
I've since gone back to the once a week CN, having a CN in the middle of the work week turned out to be a pain in the ass, at least for me. For tracking, and I know it's not the best stat to track, was just weight using the Fitbit app (free), you can easily do this in a spreadsheet and then plot a graph from the data. If you take the most oversimplified 'why to CN' it's to help reboot your body into fat burning mode, so given that and your graph, you would want to have your CN when the graph flattens/plateaus. Yeah, probably not the best reasoning but it made simple sense.
So take this simple screenshot as an example. You can clearly see where my pre-CN weigh in was, the post-CN gain, retain, and downward slope. So why not extend that slope out a little more? Again I acknowledge there is a lot more to just weight alone. But at least you can see why I fooled around with it.so given that and your graph, you would want to have your CN when the graph flattens/plateaus. Yeah, probably not the best reasoning but it made simple sense.Again I acknowledge there is a lot more to just weight alone. But at least you can see why I fooled around with it.I am tracking with multiple devices just to be sure. I am looking for confirmation that moving the Carb Nite out to 10 days increases fat loss or does it not matter. Also wondering about the maximum advised time between CN's to keep hormones at normal levels.
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