Back loading and Olympic Weightlifting

[AkumaZ]

Wondering how does back loading work with the Olympic lifts?  I'm beginning to wonder they don't evoke a strong enough muscular contraction to merit a backload, especially for inefficient lifters like me (best clean is 75% of my best front squat).Of course if heavy squatting is involved that doesn't matter, at least on those days.Motivation for asking is I have been trying to run SA but have managed to gain a few pounds, which normally wouldn't be a big deal but my original goal was to recomp with some fat loss with the goal of dropping to a lower weight class, now I'm closer to the top of the 77kg class.I was thinking a modified hybrid CBL/CNS might be best for thisSomething like:Monday evening workout w/ 5/3/1 squats followed by backloadTues morning workout (overhead press and power snatch/cj)ULC dayWednesday evening workout with 5/3/1 deadlift (only hitting prescribed reps, no + reps) ULC or backload?Thurs  morning workout (bench press and power movements) ULCFriday evening workout with 5/3/1 squats backloadSat and sun off, no backload SundayOverall 2 back loading days, maybe a third on Wednesday but I don't think it necessarily merits one, though I suppose some heavier front squats might earn itI could also throw in hill sprints tues/sat to get some HIIT after a feedingAlso I realize I'm bastardizing Wendler's program but I can't see myself only squatting once a week when the volume isn't so terrible, at least for now.Thoughts?  Maybe I'm over thinking this

[Brandon D Christ]

Since Olympic lifts are very explosive, you should backload after them.  As for the deadlift day, you will still want to backload.

[Big_R]

Wondering how does back loading work with the Olympic lifts?  I'm beginning to wonder they don't evoke a strong enough muscular contraction to merit a backload, especially for inefficient lifters like me (best clean is 75% of my best front squat).Of course if heavy squatting is involved that doesn't matter, at least on those days.Motivation for asking is I have been trying to run SA but have managed to gain a few pounds, which normally wouldn't be a big deal but my original goal was to recomp with some fat loss with the goal of dropping to a lower weight class, now I'm closer to the top of the 77kg class.I was thinking a modified hybrid CBL/CNS might be best for thisSomething like:Monday evening workout w/ 5/3/1 squats followed by backloadTues morning workout (overhead press and power snatch/cj)ULC dayWednesday evening workout with 5/3/1 deadlift (only hitting prescribed reps, no + reps) ULC or backload?Thurs  morning workout (bench press and power movements) ULCFriday evening workout with 5/3/1 squats backloadSat and sun off, no backload SundayOverall 2 back loading days, maybe a third on Wednesday but I don't think it necessarily merits one, though I suppose some heavier front squats might earn itI could also throw in hill sprints tues/sat to get some HIIT after a feedingAlso I realize I'm bastardizing Wendler's program but I can't see myself only squatting once a week when the volume isn't so terrible, at least for now.Thoughts?  Maybe I'm over thinking this

Being that muscles are meant to contract explosively during the concentric portion of a lift, i consider olympic lifts to be a more native form of performance training... and personally, they drain me more than most bodybuilding exercises. i think shockwave protocol actually incorporates the push-press also, so yes back load away my friend.  Experiment to see what works for you,  that is the best option.  You can always throttle back on your carbs if you aren't sure

[AkumaZ]

Since Olympic lifts are very explosive, you should backload after them.  As for the deadlift day, you will still want to backload.

Interesting, so then the submaximal nature of the weight(compared to a more strenght-oriented lift) is mitigated by the explosive nature in terms of tGLUT and all that goodness?I am not so sure about backloading on the deadlift day yet though.  At least for my personal situation, I have not deadlifted very regularly in the last couple years, so I took my training max as something pretty light, the hardest part of doing the deadlifts was the fact that my thumbs were destroyed from hook gripping all night, but the top set of 5 was only 13kg over what I had managed to clean an hour prior.But of course if snatch/C&J are good for backloading, I guess it wouldn't matter too much would it?One more question though.  Would only backloading 2 days out of the week (which seems pretty close to a CNS/CBL hybrid) be more effective for SA with the goal of more fat loss/recomping, or does it really not matter/try it for myself"

[Brandon D Christ]

Since Olympic lifts are very explosive, you should backload after them.  As for the deadlift day, you will still want to backload.

Interesting, so then the submaximal nature of the weight(compared to a more strenght-oriented lift) is mitigated by the explosive nature in terms of tGLUT and all that goodness?I am not so sure about backloading on the deadlift day yet though.  At least for my personal situation, I have not deadlifted very regularly in the last couple years, so I took my training max as something pretty light, the hardest part of doing the deadlifts was the fact that my thumbs were destroyed from hook gripping all night, but the top set of 5 was only 13kg over what I had managed to clean an hour prior.But of course if snatch/C&J are good for backloading, I guess it wouldn't matter too much would it?One more question though.  Would only backloading 2 days out of the week (which seems pretty close to a CNS/CBL hybrid) be more effective for SA with the goal of more fat loss/recomping, or does it really not matter/try it for myself"

You don't have to backload after the deadlift workout if you view it as not challenging enough, but I really do not recommend cutting backloads out and only backloading twice a week.  This is not modified CNS, but a half-assed CNS.  From my understanding, modified CNS is only appropriate when you are very lean (under 10% for a male) and is only for pre-contest/meet.  You can do Carb Nite, but unless you really need to lose bodyfat, it really is not appropriate for a performance athlete such as yourself, during training.  I would stick to standard CBL protocol unless you need the fat loss rapidly, then do CNS.  This is my opinion.As far as tGLUT is concerned, it is translocated by heavy contractions, which I believe can occur if you are training heavy or if the movements are very explosive.  This why Kiefer said sprinting may actually translocate tGLUT as well.

[Big_R]

Since Olympic lifts are very explosive, you should backload after them.  As for the deadlift day, you will still want to backload.

Interesting, so then the submaximal nature of the weight(compared to a more strenght-oriented lift) is mitigated by the explosive nature in terms of tGLUT and all that goodness?I am not so sure about backloading on the deadlift day yet though.  At least for my personal situation, I have not deadlifted very regularly in the last couple years, so I took my training max as something pretty light, the hardest part of doing the deadlifts was the fact that my thumbs were destroyed from hook gripping all night, but the top set of 5 was only 13kg over what I had managed to clean an hour prior.But of course if snatch/C&J are good for backloading, I guess it wouldn't matter too much would it?One more question though.  Would only backloading 2 days out of the week (which seems pretty close to a CNS/CBL hybrid) be more effective for SA with the goal of more fat loss/recomping, or does it really not matter/try it for myself"

Maybe bobland can verify this, i remember in one of the podcasts kiefer said something about training to f failure and that regardless of reps if they were done explosively and to failure thru would have the same end result....  I swear i remember that in one of the podcasts...I think he favored heavy lifting tho explosively too.  Hopefully I'm not just babbling out of my ass

[AkumaZ]

Since Olympic lifts are very explosive, you should backload after them.  As for the deadlift day, you will still want to backload.

Interesting, so then the submaximal nature of the weight(compared to a more strenght-oriented lift) is mitigated by the explosive nature in terms of tGLUT and all that goodness?I am not so sure about backloading on the deadlift day yet though.  At least for my personal situation, I have not deadlifted very regularly in the last couple years, so I took my training max as something pretty light, the hardest part of doing the deadlifts was the fact that my thumbs were destroyed from hook gripping all night, but the top set of 5 was only 13kg over what I had managed to clean an hour prior.But of course if snatch/C&J are good for backloading, I guess it wouldn't matter too much would it?One more question though.  Would only backloading 2 days out of the week (which seems pretty close to a CNS/CBL hybrid) be more effective for SA with the goal of more fat loss/recomping, or does it really not matter/try it for myself"

You don't have to backload after the deadlift workout if you view it as not challenging enough, but I really do not recommend cutting backloads out and only backloading twice a week.  This is not modified CNS, but a half-assed CNS.  From my understanding, modified CNS is only appropriate when you are very lean (under 10% for a male) and is only for pre-contest/meet.  You can do Carb Nite, but unless you really need to lose bodyfat, it really is not appropriate for a performance athlete such as yourself, during training.  I would stick to standard CBL protocol unless you need the fat loss rapidly, then do CNS.  This is my opinion.As far as tGLUT is concerned, it is translocated by heavy contractions, which I believe can occur if you are training heavy or if the movements are very explosive.  This why Kiefer said sprinting may actually translocate tGLUT as well.

Cool, thanks for the input and advice, much appreciated.

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