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I'm still around 10% body fat at 180 pounds and I would like to be lower. Can you help me?At the moment, I'm training 5 times a week around 6:30 PM and backloading 5 times after training.My backloads generally looks like this:POST WO: Hypertrophic Potentiator formula ( around 40 g proteins ) with 80 g dextrose. POST POST: Jasmin rice ( 100g ) with turkey or chicken + ketchup Half an hour later : Ben and Jerry ice cream.I try to limit my BL window to 2hours maximum. No junk food.On training days, I'm ingesting between 90g/110 g of fats, 170 g protein, 200 g carbs. On non training days (ULC days) : 140g fats/ 140g protein/ under 10g carbs.I was thinking in reducing the numbers of backloads? to 3 first and probably to two with 4 days ULC between monday training and friday training.Moreover in the morning, I have AM accelerator, I was thinking as well just having coco and no whey..
You will probably need to reduce overall calories. Getting below 10% is where it starts getting hard for most people, I'd probably start decreasing your fat on backload days and still backload after every session. maybe drop 15-20g of fat to start, you could also try instead of or as well as add some cardio. Maybe 1 HIIT session and 1 day of light cardio like walking or cycling for 30 minutes or so.
Thnk you for your help Trevor. I am quite low in fats on training days around 100g, do you suggest having 85 g, that's 0.5g / BW.On non training days aka saturday and sunday, should I keep the same amount of fats 140g?And you're absolutely right for cardio, I want to do a session of HIIT but I don't really know where to put it. Here's my training schedule:Monday: Chest/TricepsTuesday: Back/Rear deltsWaednesday: Legs/CalvesThursday: Chest/DeltsFriday: Back/BicepsAnd what do you think of the whey in the AM accelerator, do you think I should get rid of it?
You can go as low as 0.4g of fat per day on training days.I would do HIIT the day after legs, in the morning. I also wouldn't do it fasted, have some whey and MCT before hand.Off days you may adjust the fat slightly, but don't make to many changes at once.
You can go as low as 0.4g of fat per day on training days.I would do HIIT the day after legs, in the morning. I also wouldn't do it fasted, have some whey and MCT before hand.Off days you may adjust the fat slightly, but don't make to many changes at once.
Yea 85 g of fat is still a decent amount of fat, especially if you are still eating carbs. You don't really get into "low fat" territory until like 40 g.
It's funny because I wanted to reduce my backloads and was even thinking of doing CNS for a while to speed up fat loss, because I thought fats were the most important nutrient and you say keep the backloads and reduce fats, thank you very much again trevor and ibo, I'm learning every day on this forum.
Today, I'm just having 80g of fat instead of 100 g. I'm going to stay at this amount for a few days and see how it goes.If I stall again I will reduce gradually from there.
You can go as low as 0.4g of fat per day on training days.I would do HIIT the day after legs, in the morning. I also wouldn't do it fasted, have some whey and MCT before hand.Off days you may adjust the fat slightly, but don't make to many changes at once.
140 g on off days is probably too much compared to 80 g on training days?
You can go as low as 0.4g of fat per day on training days.I would do HIIT the day after legs, in the morning. I also wouldn't do it fasted, have some whey and MCT before hand.Off days you may adjust the fat slightly, but don't make to many changes at once.
140 g on off days is probably too much compared to 80 g on training days?
Not necessarily if you aren't consuming carbs on off days.
Thought I'd share my two cents on this. I was in your position for a loooong time, and had big trouble getting below that 10% mark. I stressed over very specific carb amounts during backloads, being ULC at all cost during my off days, doing fasted HIIT, keeping carbs in a two-three hour window PWO and so on, and none got me to where I wanted to be.After a long time, I took a step back and tried a different approach - and the caliper test said 8,5 % bf few days ago, so it's going in the right direction. This is how I do it now:Eating very light before training (or at least until dinner), making sure my insulin is at bay, by not consuming that much protein really. And then after training, I get the rest of my calories, and whatever protein I need, through out the night. Typically through three meals. As trevor said, tracking calories to get below 10% bf is probably what it takes for you. It was for me at least. So, I'm in a roughly 500 calorie deficit (at most, some days less). When I want to gain more muscle again, I'll ofc up my calories.This would be a typical day for me:Usually I fast until around noon and in there I have a walk. Then I have like 4 eggs and couple slices of bacon, maybe with some onions or mushrooms. Then, if I'm hungry a couple of hours later, I have a very small meal worth a couple hundred calories. But, for the most part I'm not that hungry, I'll just have some coffee.I train (4 x resistance and 1 non-fasted HIIT session per week), 30 mins later have at PWO shake (whey, leucine, milk and water).Then, starting backloading maybe a hour later. Burger and fries is my favorite, but I also eat a lot of asian dishes with rice. An hour later, I'll have rice cakes with Nutella (yum!) and another PWO shake. An hour or two later, cottage cheese, until i hit my protein needs. This is like the "perfect" day for me - but I have a lot of days that are not as good as the, where I eat more junk an so, but as long as I hit my macros pretty good and thereby also calories, I seem to make progress. Also, I dont worry about a backloading window PWO - if it exists (during the evening, PWO) I don't think it is worth the stressing over it, at all! Also, I started eating carbs every night, which has also helped me a lot. It could be from the release of stress trying to be ULC on off days (I almost never eat alone, so preparing a special ULC version for me was just annoying and a huge stressor), but I do also think my body functions better on carbs every day. With that said, I ofc eat less carbs on off days and more on training days. Usually I just skip the "dessert" on off days. At the base of it, just put your self in a calorie deficit, track your macros and fit that with in the cbl frame, and I'll bet you'll see solid progress. That was what I did, and I started seeing muscles and veins popping out everywhere 🙂 Diet really is "everything" when trying to get very lean IMO - so put your focus there, and do not stress over details - it is simply not worth it.Hope this helped you some, at least just rethinking your diet strategy id you're not getting the results you want.Ask if you have some questions - the post might be a little unstructured, but is getting late, haha.
Great review 😉So you're doing a mix between SA ( mornings ) and DB ( BL carbs every nights ).How much carbs do you have in the evenings? Is this factor important for fat loss?I have 200g of carbs and I'm 180 pounds.I see that you wait 1/2 an hour before having post wo shake, I know Kiefer says that in his book for maximum fat loss, maybe should I wait a bit because I have mine straight after training.I read somewhere that the more shredded you get, the more attention you have to pay to preserve muscle mass. Do you include something during training like BCAA or high GI, I think John Meadows does something like that but he has such a high level, I can't compare with myself.Final question: what do you think of the whey in the AM accelerator shake?
Yeah, you could say that. I don't think so much in context of SA or DB anymore. I mean, it would be funny if everyone fitted perfectly within SA and/or DB. So IMO, find whatever works for you, it might be a combination of the two.I think it varies A LOT how many carbs folks can backload and still see good fat loss, so you really have to experiment. I usually have 200-250 g on training days and 100-150 on off days, although I might have more or less depending on how my training was and how much I had the day before and so on. The day with HIIT I also just go by feel.The PWO and timing, I would say, just don't stress about it, between 15-30 min is fine. And if one day you take it straight away or even wait an hour, whatever.I do not use pre workout or intra workout nutrition, and I don't intend starting, not even when trying to gain mass. I would rather focus on diet and training in general, which I think is a lot more important. Again, I really stopped stressing over details. I mean, a lot of people have made great gains without all kinds of supplements and things like that, but no one have made great gains without training and getting enough protein and such, so focus on what matters the most. Minor details is, for me at least, simply not worth the stress. I might just make it worse actually. Ofc. if details do not stress you, then try it out - you might just get those few extra % worth of gains 🙂As long as you stay under 10 g of whey in the AM accelerator shake you should be fine. I don't have one, for me IF until noon helped me lean out, but when I want to gain mass I'll start eating late breakfast again (prob. around 10 am or so) - something like eggs and bacon. I doubt how much extra that AM shake can really provide and if you may just be better of skipping food in the morning while leaning out is the goal. Remember, all this is just my opinion and based on my experiences. The take away is really, do a "cost-benefit" of the things you think of implementing to your diet and training and find out if it is worth the stress. If some of the things give you trouble, it is probably not sustainable anyway. Hope you can use the info 🙂
Yeah, you could say that. I don't think so much in context of SA or DB anymore. I mean, it would be funny if everyone fitted perfectly within SA and/or DB. So IMO, find whatever works for you, it might be a combination of the two.
I don't either. To me it's just CBL. DB and SA are actually goals. Not separate diets like most people here treat them as.
Yeah, you could say that. I don't think so much in context of SA or DB anymore. I mean, it would be funny if everyone fitted perfectly within SA and/or DB. So IMO, find whatever works for you, it might be a combination of the two.I think it varies A LOT how many carbs folks can backload and still see good fat loss, so you really have to experiment. I usually have 200-250 g on training days and 100-150 on off days, although I might have more or less depending on how my training was and how much I had the day before and so on. The day with HIIT I also just go by feel.The PWO and timing, I would say, just don't stress about it, between 15-30 min is fine. And if one day you take it straight away or even wait an hour, whatever.I do not use pre workout or intra workout nutrition, and I don't intend starting, not even when trying to gain mass. I would rather focus on diet and training in general, which I think is a lot more important. Again, I really stopped stressing over details. I mean, a lot of people have made great gains without all kinds of supplements and things like that, but no one have made great gains without training and getting enough protein and such, so focus on what matters the most. Minor details is, for me at least, simply not worth the stress. I might just make it worse actually. Ofc. if details do not stress you, then try it out - you might just get those few extra % worth of gains 🙂As long as you stay under 10 g of whey in the AM accelerator shake you should be fine. I don't have one, for me IF until noon helped me lean out, but when I want to gain mass I'll start eating late breakfast again (prob. around 10 am or so) - something like eggs and bacon. I doubt how much extra that AM shake can really provide and if you may just be better of skipping food in the morning while leaning out is the goal. Remember, all this is just my opinion and based on my experiences. The take away is really, do a "cost-benefit" of the things you think of implementing to your diet and training and find out if it is worth the stress. If some of the things give you trouble, it is probably not sustainable anyway. Hope you can use the info 🙂
How much do you weigh? How much protein and fats do you take on training days and off days?As trevor and ibobland said, you must have lowered your fat intake.On off days, do you have high GI carbs as well?I'm sorry to ask you all these questions, I hope you're not going to get fed up :-Question to trevor:Do you consider 0.4/BW fats the limit? Avoid going below this number?
Yeah, you could say that. I don't think so much in context of SA or DB anymore. I mean, it would be funny if everyone fitted perfectly within SA and/or DB. So IMO, find whatever works for you, it might be a combination of the two.I think it varies A LOT how many carbs folks can backload and still see good fat loss, so you really have to experiment. I usually have 200-250 g on training days and 100-150 on off days, although I might have more or less depending on how my training was and how much I had the day before and so on. The day with HIIT I also just go by feel.The PWO and timing, I would say, just don't stress about it, between 15-30 min is fine. And if one day you take it straight away or even wait an hour, whatever.I do not use pre workout or intra workout nutrition, and I don't intend starting, not even when trying to gain mass. I would rather focus on diet and training in general, which I think is a lot more important. Again, I really stopped stressing over details. I mean, a lot of people have made great gains without all kinds of supplements and things like that, but no one have made great gains without training and getting enough protein and such, so focus on what matters the most. Minor details is, for me at least, simply not worth the stress. I might just make it worse actually. Ofc. if details do not stress you, then try it out - you might just get those few extra % worth of gains 🙂As long as you stay under 10 g of whey in the AM accelerator shake you should be fine. I don't have one, for me IF until noon helped me lean out, but when I want to gain mass I'll start eating late breakfast again (prob. around 10 am or so) - something like eggs and bacon. I doubt how much extra that AM shake can really provide and if you may just be better of skipping food in the morning while leaning out is the goal. Remember, all this is just my opinion and based on my experiences. The take away is really, do a "cost-benefit" of the things you think of implementing to your diet and training and find out if it is worth the stress. If some of the things give you trouble, it is probably not sustainable anyway. Hope you can use the info 🙂
How much do you weigh? How much protein and fats do you take on training days and off days?As trevor and ibobland said, you must have lowered your fat intake.On off days, do you have high GI carbs as well?I'm sorry to ask you all these questions, I hope you're not going to get fed up :-Question to trevor:Do you consider 0.4/BW fats the limit? Avoid going below this number?
You could probably go slightly under that on some days if you are having higher fat days on other days, but 0.4 is pretty much the bottom range I'd take a natural.
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