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Reading this forum, I seem to see most people recommending rice and potatoes as "clean" foods for carb loading, yet even in the videos Keifer emailed out this last week, he said people who try to back load cleanly (he mentioned potatoes and brown rice, obviously brown is worse for backloading than white rice) often see worse results than people who stick to dirtier carbs. So I've been a little confused about it myself. My wife loves to bake, so there's no shortage of home made baked goods around here. My first time back loading worked well, I got leaner and stronger, though my back loads were fairly small and I was out of the country and didn't have my wife around to bake for me. After some moving around and vacationing and things I was fatter again so my wife and I did CNS for a few weeks. I was lean enough to want to go back to back loading, but with so much baked goodness available, even only back loading from about 7pm-11pm, I seemed to be getting fatter. We relaxed a little for the holidays and are on CNS again. Next month I'll go back to back loading. This time I want to try to back load as clean as possible 6 nights a week and enjoy the good stuff on my wife's carb nights. I'm hoping that way I'll get good results while still enjoying plenty of junk once a week, and that my daily back loads will be bland enough my wife won't be tempted to join in lol. I'll just have to wait and see what the results are with back loads that are lower in fat and sugar compared to what's happened in the past, and how much I can get away with eating if it's cleaner. I do think my results were good with dirty carbs as long as the back loads weren't too big.
I don't ever recall Kiefer saying not to backload with potatoes, as he has recommended them several times. Again there is a semantics issue. White rice and potatoes are NOT traditionally considered clean carbs. They were considered junk.
I can't remember if I've ever seen or heard him recommend potatoes, but it's good to know he has, thanks.
He's mentioned it on podcasts. Also he mentions it on page 142 of CBL.
Potatoes always carry the caveat of needing to be waxy red potatoes or overbaked sweet potatoes.
Correct. All potatoes need to be baked to be high glycemic.
You know,Carb Backloading was supposed to be for simple minded donut loving schmucks like me.It now seems that recommended carb choices are a bit elitist and "clean".
My take on this,comes from a noob perspective.3 months ago,I couldn't tell you what HFCS was,and I would have laughed in your face if someone suggested bacon grease over vegetable oil.I was attracted to CBL and Carb Nite because it just seemed to be a re-ordering of the macros and a guide for timing and when to have them.Pretty simple,but a radical change for me.Things seem to be working well for me,as I continue to dial it in,and have the support of a community where we can talk about this stuff in a conversational matter.But,now as I drill deeper into this,the food choices are becoming more restrictive,as I factor in not only what I want to have,but also what I don't want to have.I guess this is the same with anyone that wants to stick with it.Stick with it,and also not be driven nuts by the new knowledge in my big bad brain.I'm not much of a cook,and don't have a whole lot of time to do it,but I can't see any way to stick with it without cooking a majority of it and becoming a tupperware bandit.Which is cool,and way worth it,but a long way off from the pizza and donut image.
You know,Carb Backloading was supposed to be for simple minded donut loving schmucks like me.It now seems that recommended carb choices are a bit elitist and "clean".
My take on this,comes from a noob perspective.3 months ago,I couldn't tell you what HFCS was,and I would have laughed in your face if someone suggested bacon grease over vegetable oil.I was attracted to CBL and Carb Nite because it just seemed to be a re-ordering of the macros and a guide for timing and when to have them.Pretty simple,but a radical change for me.Things seem to be working well for me,as I continue to dial it in,and have the support of a community where we can talk about this stuff in a conversational matter.But,now as I drill deeper into this,the food choices are becoming more restrictive,as I factor in not only what I want to have,but also what I don't want to have.I guess this is the same with anyone that wants to stick with it.Stick with it,and also not be driven nuts by the new knowledge in my big bad brain.I'm not much of a cook,and don't have a whole lot of time to do it,but I can't see any way to stick with it without cooking a majority of it and becoming a tupperware bandit.Which is cool,and way worth it,but a long way off from the pizza and donut image.
What you are referring to is the strong paleo influence that this forum has. As well as Kiefer's involvement in that world. None of this required with CBL. Read the Jay DeMayo case study in the CBL book on page 190. He backloaded with Wendy's and pizza and he did very well.CBL does not require you to eat paleo, regardless of what the paleo fanatics on this forum claim. Don't get me wrong I eat mostly paleo, but I do indulge in pizzas and shitty microwavable pulled pork from the grocery store.
Let's make “Paleo” a bad word. Kinda getting tired of seeing it and reading it. Haha. Just like everyone referring to what is “clean” and “dirty”. I can take a “clean” carb and make it “dirty”, as well as taking a “dirty” carb making it “clean”.
Ha ha,yes.About 2 weeks after getting CBL and reading the forums,I had to go back and read about the Wendy's chicken guy again to see if it were still in there.Definitely doesn't fit in here.Well,it just seems that whenever the word "podcast" appears,the food selection just got more restrictive and specialized.What I mean is,if Keifer says that vegetable oil is shit,Am I submarining all of the good I am doing by eating something during the day that is prepared with it? It's a little difficult to assign the degree of importance to the new proclamations.Yeah,I get it,moderation and common sense,right?But I guess it would help to have a blacklist of "must avoids".
Ha ha,yes.About 2 weeks after getting CBL and reading the forums,I had to go back and read about the Wendy's chicken guy again to see if it were still in there.Definitely doesn't fit in here.Well,it just seems that whenever the word "podcast" appears,the food selection just got more restrictive and specialized.What I mean is,if Keifer says that vegetable oil is shit,Am I submarining all of the good I am doing by eating something during the day that is prepared with it? It's a little difficult to assign the degree of importance to the new proclamations.Yeah,I get it,moderation and common sense,right?But I guess it would help to have a blacklist of "must avoids".
that's kind of a hard question though.. "must avoid" for what? for CBL to work and you get big and strong? you really don't have to avoid ANYTHING.. hell look at CT Fletcher he ate a LOT of McDonald's every single day to help get him as big and as strong as he is today. But all that also led him to have heart attack.. so really in regards to getting strong and muscular there really is nothing you can't eat. But you want to be healthy and live past 40 or 50 you may want to be more cautious on food choices
Ha ha,yes.About 2 weeks after getting CBL and reading the forums,I had to go back and read about the Wendy's chicken guy again to see if it were still in there.Definitely doesn't fit in here.Well,it just seems that whenever the word "podcast" appears,the food selection just got more restrictive and specialized.What I mean is,if Keifer says that vegetable oil is shit,Am I submarining all of the good I am doing by eating something during the day that is prepared with it? It's a little difficult to assign the degree of importance to the new proclamations.Yeah,I get it,moderation and common sense,right?But I guess it would help to have a blacklist of "must avoids".
I think the people that do the best on CBL are those who read the book and never go on these forums at all. The paleo people have really, really, fucked a lot of things up. It's good that a lot of people care about their health, but those people lose sight that this is a performance diet, not a health one. There is a lot of crossover between the goals, but let's keep everything performance focused. That is why I never give health advice unless someone asks for it.These forums were much better in this regards when they first started. Nearly everyone was performance minded. Now the forums have turned into the Paleo lifters forum.
Ha ha,yes.About 2 weeks after getting CBL and reading the forums,I had to go back and read about the Wendy's chicken guy again to see if it were still in there.Definitely doesn't fit in here.Well,it just seems that whenever the word "podcast" appears,the food selection just got more restrictive and specialized.What I mean is,if Keifer says that vegetable oil is shit,Am I submarining all of the good I am doing by eating something during the day that is prepared with it? It's a little difficult to assign the degree of importance to the new proclamations.Yeah,I get it,moderation and common sense,right?But I guess it would help to have a blacklist of "must avoids".
that's kind of a hard question though.. "must avoid" for what? for CBL to work and you get big and strong? you really don't have to avoid ANYTHING.. hell look at CT Fletcher he ate a LOT of McDonald's every single day to help get him as big and as strong as he is today. But all that also led him to have heart attack.. so really in regards to getting strong and muscular there really is nothing you can't eat. But you want to be healthy and live past 40 or 50 you may want to be more cautious on food choices
Ha ha,yes.About 2 weeks after getting CBL and reading the forums,I had to go back and read about the Wendy's chicken guy again to see if it were still in there.Definitely doesn't fit in here.Well,it just seems that whenever the word "podcast" appears,the food selection just got more restrictive and specialized.What I mean is,if Keifer says that vegetable oil is shit,Am I submarining all of the good I am doing by eating something during the day that is prepared with it? It's a little difficult to assign the degree of importance to the new proclamations.Yeah,I get it,moderation and common sense,right?But I guess it would help to have a blacklist of "must avoids".
I think the people that do the best on CBL are those who read the book and never go on these forums at all. The paleo people have really, really, fucked a lot of things up. It's good that a lot of people care about their health, but those people lose sight that this is a performance diet, not a health one. There is a lot of crossover between the goals, but let's keep everything performance focused. That is why I never give health advice unless someone asks for it.These forums were much better in this regards when they first started. Nearly everyone was performance minded. Now the forums have turned into the Paleo lifters forum.
considering kiefers last several podcasts it seems kiefer is heading that way as well trying to blend healthier eating with performance.. i see no problems in that
Yes,roger that.I get that there can be a disconnect between health and muscle.But to say that McDonald's caused a guy's heart attack is a leap also.I also think that the blacklist is out there,especially to some folks.
Yes,roger that.I get that there can be a disconnect between health and muscle.But to say that McDonald's caused a guy's heart attack is a leap also.I also think that the blacklist is out there,especially to some folks.
well that of course is what his doctors told him.. if that's really the truth of the matter who knows.. but basically drinking a gallon of vegetable oil a day can't be good for anyone heh
Doctors.....mmm,Ok.
haha yea i wouldn't take their word on any of it.. but I have read articles and stories of many old bodybuilders that are still around today and most of them that are still alive and still thriving ate "healthy" through there lives from what they say.. obviously steroids is a big factor in the health of many athletes though and probably a big contributing factor in some of the health issues
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