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So I know you can go into Ketosis without depleting Muscle glycogen, but still depleting liver glycogen. Is that what those carbs are for? Because I've read various articles and studies that show that Liver Glycogen stores are usually pretty small, and are emptied after an overnight fast. Even in Lyle McDonalds Ketogenic Diet he shows that Liver Glycogen stores are no more than 100g even in bodybuilders. Since the body is used to burning fat it will more readily turn to producing ketones for energy instead of turning to muscle glycogen, is this correct?
To that i know that liver glycogen can get pretty high!!!!Glycogen is the only think that those not make the liver sick so it can hold a shit tone of it, and there is actually a disease that makes people store endless amounts of glycogen and even them there livers are just fine...Fructose how ever burns out the liver a lot...
Im sorry if maybe english isnt your first language, but I tried really hard to understand this post its just gibberish! Fructose is prefered by the liver and doesn't "burn" anything out. For someone who is metabolically challenged (i.e diabetes etc) it actually makes more sense to use frutose more so than glucose since insulin isnt required to utilise it. There are people who have trouble storing glycogen but Im not aware of any metabolic "problem" that causes excess glycogen storage. If there was a way of doing this Im sure a lot of endurance athletes and bodybuilders would be keen to know how.
So I know you can go into Ketosis without depleting Muscle glycogen, but still depleting liver glycogen. Is that what those carbs are for? Because I've read various articles and studies that show that Liver Glycogen stores are usually pretty small, and are emptied after an overnight fast. Even in Lyle McDonalds Ketogenic Diet he shows that Liver Glycogen stores are no more than 100g even in bodybuilders. Since the body is used to burning fat it will more readily turn to producing ketones for energy instead of turning to muscle glycogen, is this correct?
To that i know that liver glycogen can get pretty high!!!!Glycogen is the only think that those not make the liver sick so it can hold a shit tone of it, and there is actually a disease that makes people store endless amounts of glycogen and even them there livers are just fine...Fructose how ever burns out the liver a lot...
Im sorry if maybe english isnt your first language, but I tried really hard to understand this post its just gibberish! Fructose is prefered by the liver and doesn't "burn" anything out. For someone who is metabolically challenged (i.e diabetes etc) it actually makes more sense to use frutose more so than glucose since insulin isnt required to utilise it. There are people who have trouble storing glycogen but Im not aware of any metabolic "problem" that causes excess glycogen storage. If there was a way of doing this Im sure a lot of endurance athletes and bodybuilders would be keen to know how.
Yea he was from Portugal. He doesn't post anymore though.
So I know you can go into Ketosis without depleting Muscle glycogen, but still depleting liver glycogen. Is that what those carbs are for? Because I've read various articles and studies that show that Liver Glycogen stores are usually pretty small, and are emptied after an overnight fast. Even in Lyle McDonalds Ketogenic Diet he shows that Liver Glycogen stores are no more than 100g even in bodybuilders. Since the body is used to burning fat it will more readily turn to producing ketones for energy instead of turning to muscle glycogen, is this correct?
To that i know that liver glycogen can get pretty high!!!!Glycogen is the only think that those not make the liver sick so it can hold a shit tone of it, and there is actually a disease that makes people store endless amounts of glycogen and even them there livers are just fine...Fructose how ever burns out the liver a lot...
Im sorry if maybe english isnt your first language, but I tried really hard to understand this post its just gibberish! Fructose is prefered by the liver and doesn't "burn" anything out. For someone who is metabolically challenged (i.e diabetes etc) it actually makes more sense to use frutose more so than glucose since insulin isnt required to utilise it. There are people who have trouble storing glycogen but Im not aware of any metabolic "problem" that causes excess glycogen storage. If there was a way of doing this Im sure a lot of endurance athletes and bodybuilders would be keen to know how.
Yea he was from Portugal. He doesn't post anymore though.
D'oh I totally missed the time stamp! 2013 LOL.
1. I was explaining to d3spwn why he was able to measure ketones after consuming carbs. I don't know a better way to explain it than the way I did.
No, not the way you explained it, the way MikeScience stated that Kiefer explained it. In the context of saying that the day after a CBL that a person is highly ketogenic, it seems obvious that what was meant was that the day after a CBL the person wakes up producing ketone bodies that are being produced and used in place of glucose (ketogenic), not that the person is just excreting ketone bodies in the urine (ketosis). Anyway, I've got the book so I can look to see what he actually wrote myself. But that isn't the point. Everyone is producing at least some ketone bodies over a day, since a ketone is the result of incomplete fat metabolism. The actual point is that the day after a person wakes up from eating 300+ grams of high GI, net carbs they are either mostly ketogenic or not (in terms of production and utilization of ketones, not in terms of excretion). The validity of a person being mostly ketogenic in production/utilization after a CBL night is highly unlikely without some unexplained process.This isn't important, since I'm not aware of any solid research that shows a metabolic advantage in burning more fat via ketogenesis than through normal fat oxidation. There is research that ketosis comes with negative side-effect not experienced on non-ketogenic low-carb diets. All that matters is that when you wake up the body is burning mostly fat for energy. That said, everyone wakes up in a mostly fat burning state after a full night of sleep, regardless of their diet.
2. Blood sugar must be in a certain range or else you will die. Blood sugar is toxic once it reaches a certain point.
Dude. Blood triglyceride levels, PH, pressure, viscosity, etc... all have to be within a certain range or you'll die. You can fill-in-the-blank with any part of any living creature, and if it ins't within a certain range that creature will die. There's nothing inherently toxic about glucose any more than there is amino acids, or water for that matter.That said, a high concentration of ketones in the blood lowers blood PH significantly.
Maybe the fact that glucose is the preferred fuel choice is the real reason why ketogenesis has stopped, but that still doesn't make what I said incorrect. Think about this: What do you think happens when alcohol is consumed with carbohydrates?
I'm pretty sure that it's the same thing when you eat fat or protein, its metabolism is held up until the alcohol is broken down. But, it's funny you asked that in the context of a discussion about ketosis. Technically, traffic backs up in the liver, because alcohol metabolism uses all the available niacin (through a coenzyme NAD that's converted to NADH). As NADH builds up, the TCA cycle slows so pyruvate and acetyl CoA build up until they're sent to be synthesized into fatty acids -clogging the liver with fat -on top of consumed fat. This is the reason alcoholics develop a fatty liver. A fatty liver has a hard time generating glucose from protein. The lack of glucose and the build up of acetyl CoA, set the stage for ketosis. The body uses the acetyl CoA and amino acids to make ketone bodies, and pyruvate into lactic acid, all of which pushes the body's acid-base balance toward an acidic state.
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