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February 24, 2012 at 9:33 pm #876
LatasaurusFlexKeymasterAre there times during the CNS to use Leucine besides during the Carb Nite itself?I read it is a ketogenic amino acid, meaning it will raise ketones, not glucose levels?I know that raising ketone levels can cause an insulin spike, knocking one out of ketogenisis. Is there a way to combine leucine, MCT's, Whey in order to trigger anabolic pathways post workout without causing an insulin spike, and keeping one in ketosis? Basically maximizing non-insulin mediated anabolic pathways while maintaining ketosis (most likely leveraged in the post workout window). Thanks!
February 24, 2012 at 9:47 pm #37830
Damon AmatoParticipantI think you answered your own question, but in case you didn't, use leucine with hydrolyzed WPI after a workout while on CNS, and then also during your carb nite.
February 24, 2012 at 11:39 pm #37831
LatasaurusFlexGuestBut does it need to be combined with MCT oil to minimize blood glucose levels? Will taking a large amount of leucine and hydrolyzed wpi knock me out of “low carb mode”, or is impossible to spike insulin and blood sugar without carbs.
February 24, 2012 at 11:59 pm #37832
IOWA.PharmDMemberLeucine doesn't raise BG, just insulin. This is what you want after workouts ONLY while your muscle's GLUT4 transporters are shuffled to the outside of the cell. This is when “nutrient uptake” occurs. It is discouraged to take in large amounts (>10g) of WPI anytime pre-workout b/c it will spike insulin causing a halt to w/e fat burning is occurring. To offset any large intake of protein, it is recommended to ingest it with equal amounts (gram to gram) of fats.
March 6, 2012 at 7:34 pm #37833
LatasaurusFlexGuestUsing a Dirty Bodybuilding Trick… the Legal VersionDrug-using bodybuilders who diet down using an ''anabolic diet type'' diet (5-6 days low carbs / 1-2 days carb-up) have been using a dirty and dangerous trick to quickly bonk themselves into ketosis. Ketosis is a state where your body produces ketones, an indication your body has switched to a fat-adapted metabolism (using primarily fat for fuel).The faster you can get in ketosis, the more effective the low-carb diet becomes. A low-carb diet is also much easier physiologically and psychologically when you're in ketosis. Why? Because the brain can only use carbs and ketones for fuel. When you go low carbs but aren't yet in ketosis, your brain will crave carbs for energy and you get sugar cravings. When ketones are being produced, the brain will use them instead and you won't crave carbs as much.After a normal carb-up, it takes 2-3 days of low-carbs dieting/training to get back in ketosis. This only leaves 2-3 days per week of maximal and comfortable fat loss. (Note that you'll still lose fat during the first 2-3 days in which ketosis isn't yet established.)Some bodybuilders have been using insulin to get into ketosis faster. Insulin drives blood glucose into the muscles and reduces the mobilization of glycogen for fuel. As a result, your blood sugar goes down and the body switches to a ketogenic state much faster.So instead of taking 2-3 days to get into ketosis, it takes them a 1/2 day. They use the insulin (low doses, around 3IU, of Humalog, the fastest acting insulin) every 2 hours in the evening while consuming only protein and some fats. This obviously leads to very low blood sugar (which is why it's very dangerous) and by next morning they're already in ketosis.As I mentioned, don't try this on your own. Using insulin is already dangerous as it is, but it's even more so when you're not ingesting carbs! It could lead to hypoglycemia, diabetic coma, or even death!A safer (and legal) way to accomplish the same thing is to use Leucine for the same purpose as insulin. Leucine is a ketogenic amino acid. It leads to a large (but within your own natural limits) insulin spike. If you don't consume any carbs 1 hour prior and up to 2 hours after ingesting leucine, your blood glucose will lower significantly, helping you reach ketosis faster.You can do this on your carb-up day, which would look like this:Morning (1-2 meals): carbs from fruit to fill liver glycogen firstBetween 11 am and 2 pm (2 meals): carbs from starchy sources (rice, yams, potatoes, etc.)Mid-afternoon meal (around 3-4 pm): last carb meal of the day... high glycemic carbsAnd from 4 pm you only have protein and fat along with ingesting 5-10g of leucine every 2 hours (5 pm, 7 pm, 9 pm, 11 pm for example). The key is no carbs after 3-4 pm.This will help you get into ketosis much faster and it will be both easier and more effective to diet down while in a low carb state.
What do people think of this? I think it is pretty interesting, is there anything here that disagrees with the CNS?
June 15, 2012 at 8:31 pm #37834
Jeffrey HansenParticipantSeems like leucine would be a perfect right before bed drink on CBL
June 19, 2012 at 4:46 pm #37835
ffemtmcdGuestThis is what I was wondering about – So, Leucine on workout days in PWO shake with protein (and fat?) or just without carbs? And Leucine before bed on carb nite (using CNS)?2 things in the article aren't in sync with carb nite - that I see right off - Fructose and carbs before 4pm
June 19, 2012 at 4:49 pm #37836
Trevor G FullbrightModeratorThis is what I was wondering about - So, Leucine on workout days in PWO shake with protein (and fat?) or just without carbs? And Leucine before bed on carb nite (using CNS)?2 things in the article aren't in sync with carb nite - that I see right off - Fructose and carbs before 4pm
Leucine PWO with protein and no fat.Also, leucine to start Carb night with, I will also use it once in the middle, and about 30-45 minutes before bed.
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