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6. Keep macros to 0.5 fat and 1 protein x target body weight (Here i have a question though, isn't 1600KCal a little bit to low?)Cheers!
Take a look at the videos and listen to the podcasts DH Keifer mentions a few times in different recent podcasts that the 0.5 fat per target is a starting point and to adjust things as you go along. So do it was recommended the week or 2 and adjust from there.In the podcast with Jonathan Watson from propane fitness he talks about weekly caloric deficit.
Correct, but for people that are carrying a lot of bodyfat, Kiefer said he keeps them on that for a while, unless it needs to be adjusted for some reason.
What might the reasons be to increase to say 0.75 fat? Mental or lifting performance maybe?
What might the reasons be to increase to say 0.75 fat? Mental or lifting performance maybe?
Possibly both.I'll find out for myself soon enough.
Hi Bagaboo,I just wanted to offer a counterpoint to some of the previous advice regarding CNS vs CBL for your situation. Tex and Dr Patel both know a lot about this and I'm not disagreeing with their advice, or suggesting that you shouldn't give CNS a go. But I would urge you to listen to your body, review your progress and make sure the approach you take meets your goals.I have also previously over-trained/under eaten my way into an overweight metabolic hell and put on around 25kg of lard in 4 months during 2011. Thank you crossfit + ultra low carb paleo!CBL is the first thing I've found that's shifting that fat and it's coming off quickly. The anabolic effect has also been awesome - I've strength trained for 16 years (natural) so we're not talking novice effect and i've never seen the kind of muscle growth i'm getting from CBL. My general happiness and mood are also excellent on CBL.After experiencing the power of CBL I tried CNS based on the reccomendations for my starting body fat %, but it really wasn't a good fit for me. My energy levels plummetted, training performance was horrible, sleep was ruined, appetite was absent, sex drive disappeared, skin conditions flared up, I was cranky and irritable (no surprise!), and to top it all off, fat loss slowed to a crawl compared to CBL.I'm now back on CBL and am feeling great, with everything I described above back on track. Good luck, I hope I haven't confused the issue too much but look after yourself and remember there are plenty of people here who can help you reach your goals, whichever path you choose.
Hi Bagaboo,I just wanted to offer a counterpoint to some of the previous advice regarding CNS vs CBL for your situation. Tex and Dr Patel both know a lot about this and I'm not disagreeing with their advice, or suggesting that you shouldn't give CNS a go. But I would urge you to listen to your body, review your progress and make sure the approach you take meets your goals.I have also previously over-trained/under eaten my way into an overweight metabolic hell and put on around 25kg of lard in 4 months during 2011. Thank you crossfit + ultra low carb paleo!CBL is the first thing I've found that's shifting that fat and it's coming off quickly. The anabolic effect has also been awesome - I've strength trained for 16 years (natural) so we're not talking novice effect and i've never seen the kind of muscle growth i'm getting from CBL. My general happiness and mood are also excellent on CBL.After experiencing the power of CBL I tried CNS based on the reccomendations for my starting body fat %, but it really wasn't a good fit for me. My energy levels plummetted, training performance was horrible, sleep was ruined, appetite was absent, sex drive disappeared, skin conditions flared up, I was cranky and irritable (no surprise!), and to top it all off, fat loss slowed to a crawl compared to CBL.I'm now back on CBL and am feeling great, with everything I described above back on track. Good luck, I hope I haven't confused the issue too much but look after yourself and remember there are plenty of people here who can help you reach your goals, whichever path you choose.
Glad to hear that you are on the right path again. Also glad that i am not the only one going down that road with overtraining and undereating. For a while i thought that it was something wrong with me, not with what i was doing. I recognize what you say about fat gain, lack of sleep, miserable mood, energy levels, brain fog, sex drive etc. from my experiments with the ketogenic diet during which i could go for weeks at a time with almost zero carbs.I have not been doing CBL for long, and have already got lots of comments about how "vital" and "fresh" i look and about my higher energy levels. I have slept like a baby and feel like a million bucks. So i have decided to take in all the advice and give CBL a shot for a few weeks and listen VERY carefully to my body and make minor adjustments along the way. And also, take it easy and not hurry as long as the gym performance is going up and fat is going down. Thank you very much for your input and i will be following your progress with great interest!
What might the reasons be to increase to say 0.75 fat? Mental or lifting performance maybe?
Possibly both.I'll find out for myself soon enough.
Please keep us posted.
Hi Bagaboo,I just wanted to offer a counterpoint to some of the previous advice regarding CNS vs CBL for your situation. Tex and Dr Patel both know a lot about this and I'm not disagreeing with their advice, or suggesting that you shouldn't give CNS a go. But I would urge you to listen to your body, review your progress and make sure the approach you take meets your goals.Huh...never said anything about not doing CNS, actually encouraged it because he can lost body fat faster and better than CBL at the moment. Optimize his health before you throw him in to a pit of fire and fail. Yes listening to your body is key in the protocols, no doubt, but the suggestions that was given is seemingly the better choice at the moment.I have also previously over-trained/under eaten my way into an overweight metabolic hell and put on around 25kg of lard in 4 months during 2011. Thank you crossfit + ultra low carb paleo!CBL is the first thing I've found that's shifting that fat and it's coming off quickly. The anabolic effect has also been awesome - I've strength trained for 16 years (natural) so we're not talking novice effect and i've never seen the kind of muscle growth i'm getting from CBL. My general happiness and mood are also excellent on CBL.After experiencing the power of CBL I tried CNS based on the reccomendations for my starting body fat %, but it really wasn't a good fit for me. My energy levels plummetted, training performance was horrible, sleep was ruined, appetite was absent, sex drive disappeared, skin conditions flared up, I was cranky and irritable (no surprise!), and to top it all off, fat loss slowed to a crawl compared to CBL.I'm now back on CBL and am feeling great, with everything I described above back on track. Good luck, I hope I haven't confused the issue too much but look after yourself and remember there are plenty of people here who can help you reach your goals, whichever path you choose.
HiTex, I think you've misunderstood my post. I know you recommended CNS and I understand why you would do so, but the OP mentioned that he does not do so well on low carb diets and cited some specific examples of the negative effects he experiences on low carb. He also details a history of over training / under eating and it seems to be something of a common theme that people with a history of hormonal disregulation / metabolic derrangement / exhaustion / adrenal fatigue etc tend to fair very poorly on low carb diets - I assume reduced ability to tolerate stress would be a major factor here.Most people I've met who've dug themselves into a hormonal hole have a tremendous ability to "suck it up", eat clean, train hard and ignore the signals our bodies give us when things are going wrong. And believe me our bodies will fight tooth and nail to protect ourselves from our own misguided best intentions. For me, ULC is a surefire way to increase body fat, decrease muscle mass and send myself straight back to the hurt locker with a rapid deterioration in health and wellbeing. In my own n=1 experiment, CBL is working as advertised with none of the adverse side effects i get on ULC. I thought it was worth sharing my own experience as those of us on a road to recovery sometimes find we must take a more winding path if we hope to reach our destination.
Most people I've met who've dug themselves into a hormonal hole have a tremendous ability to "suck it up", eat clean, train hard and ignore the signals our bodies give us when things are going wrong. And believe me our bodies will fight tooth and nail to protect ourselves from our own misguided best intentions. For me, ULC is a surefire way to increase body fat, decrease muscle mass and send myself straight back to the hurt locker with a rapid deterioration in health and wellbeing.
THAT is EXACTLY my problem. I am extremely patient and have an incredible ability to ignore signals from my own body regardless of how much they hurt. I just "suck it up" and keep doing it thinking that "giving it enough time, my body will adapt". That is why i am in the process of relearning to interpret the signals my body gives me in order to make changes depending on the results. And right now, things are looking really good. If it works, i will keep doing it. When it stops working, i will make minor changes.
HiTex, I think you've misunderstood my post. I know you recommended CNS and I understand why you would do so, but the OP mentioned that he does not do so well on low carb diets and cited some specific examples of the negative effects he experiences on low carb. He also details a history of over training / under eating and it seems to be something of a common theme that people with a history of hormonal disregulation / metabolic derrangement / exhaustion / adrenal fatigue etc tend to fair very poorly on low carb diets - I assume reduced ability to tolerate stress would be a major factor here.Most people I've met who've dug themselves into a hormonal hole have a tremendous ability to "suck it up", eat clean, train hard and ignore the signals our bodies give us when things are going wrong. And believe me our bodies will fight tooth and nail to protect ourselves from our own misguided best intentions. For me, ULC is a surefire way to increase body fat, decrease muscle mass and send myself straight back to the hurt locker with a rapid deterioration in health and wellbeing. In my own n=1 experiment, CBL is working as advertised with none of the adverse side effects i get on ULC. I thought it was worth sharing my own experience as those of us on a road to recovery sometimes find we must take a more winding path if we hope to reach our destination.
From your own previous post you mentioned you did Crossfit when you were low carb and I am also under the impression you were not on a Cyclic Ketogenic Diet with weekly carb re-feeds. You therefore broke the two requirements for low carb dieting:1. You trained too intensely. If you are doing intense training like CrossFit, you are going to have to consume carbs on training days at the very least.2. You didn't have refeeds. Low carb diets down regulate thyroid hormones if you don't have refeeds weekly.Number 1 raised cortisol levels through the roof and number 2 down regulated your thyroid so it is no surprise you gained fat. I'm glad you are doing well on CBL, but the general recommendation is to do Carb Nite if you are at higher body fat levels because CBL is really easy to screw up due to poor insulin sensitivity.To the OP, you choose to do CBL I would recommend starting out with 1 g/lb of carbs in your backloads post training. Be careful.
HiTex, I think you've misunderstood my post. I know you recommended CNS and I understand why you would do so, but the OP mentioned that he does not do so well on low carb diets and cited some specific examples of the negative effects he experiences on low carb. He also details a history of over training / under eating and it seems to be something of a common theme that people with a history of hormonal disregulation / metabolic derrangement / exhaustion / adrenal fatigue etc tend to fair very poorly on low carb diets - I assume reduced ability to tolerate stress would be a major factor here.Most people I've met who've dug themselves into a hormonal hole have a tremendous ability to "suck it up", eat clean, train hard and ignore the signals our bodies give us when things are going wrong. And believe me our bodies will fight tooth and nail to protect ourselves from our own misguided best intentions. For me, ULC is a surefire way to increase body fat, decrease muscle mass and send myself straight back to the hurt locker with a rapid deterioration in health and wellbeing. In my own n=1 experiment, CBL is working as advertised with none of the adverse side effects i get on ULC. I thought it was worth sharing my own experience as those of us on a road to recovery sometimes find we must take a more winding path if we hope to reach our destination.
From your own previous post you mentioned you did Crossfit when you were low carb and I am also under the impression you were not on a Cyclic Ketogenic Diet with weekly carb re-feeds. You therefore broke the two requirements for low carb dieting:1. You trained too intensely. If you are doing intense training like CrossFit, you are going to have to consume carbs on training days at the very least.2. You didn't have refeeds. Low carb diets down regulate thyroid hormones if you don't have refeeds weekly.Number 1 raised cortisol levels through the roof and number 2 down regulated your thyroid so it is no surprise you gained fat. I'm glad you are doing well on CBL, but the general recommendation is to do Carb Nite if you are at higher body fat levels because CBL is really easy to screw up due to poor insulin sensitivity.To the OP, you choose to do CBL I would recommend starting out with 1 g/lb of carbs in your backloads post training. Be careful.
You are absolutely correct about 1 and 2. I found out the hard way. Some days i could train for 3x1.5 hours (Running, Karate and weight lifting) and consume 1200KCal without carbs per day. Damn stupid and i regret it so much. I did some glucose tolerance tests and the results are quite normal compared to a less abused person. Right now i am backloading with 200g, 4 times a week for two weeks and will listen very carefully to how my body reacts. Then i will regulate to 150 or 250 depending on the results (strength gains and fat loss). So far so good! Another upside is that my wife is so very happy that we finally can eat "normal" food at least 4 times each week 🙂
Ok. Is this normal? Is this what should be expected?First chart: one month on CBL. Almost nothing happend weight wise. Moderate strength gains. Second chart: first month on CNS. Some weight loss. Good strength gains. Third chart: second month on CNS. The gap is a vacation during which i was quite strict. Good strength gains. Weekly Average KCal per day ULC: 2200. Protein aprox. 220g. Fat aprox. 110g. Somewhat higher KCal on CN's. 250-350g of carbs in each reload. Lifting body building style 3 times a week. Sleeps 6-8 hours per night. Works office hours, trains after work at 18:00. No breakfast, lunch 12:00, dinner 20:00, sometimes a snack 22:00. The third CNS month i will try to keep fat:protein to 1:1 and protein roughly to 1.2g/kg bodyweight. So aprox. 110g fat and 110g protein. This should be around 1500 KCal. You think this is a good idea?
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