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Cookie,I absolutely here your Frustration here. I am extremely frustrated now because I was feel good for a while on this diet, but today I feel fat as all shit. Granted, I never smoked so I can not comment on that aspect, but I feel like I am ready to give up! I am the definition of the classic skinny-fat, which I absolutely hate. I feel down on myself all the time. Maybe I am eating too much food during the week that has caught up to me now? I have no idea what my matinence is at all. Is that the amount of calories that I should be eating on this diet? I have no idea. Maybe I need to cut back on my fat intake and eat more protein? I really dont work out much right now because I feel too depressed sometimes. Im actually pretty inactive. What do you think I should do?Suggestions?im 28 female about 131lbs. I workout maybe once or twice a week after carbnite with the Insanity program for HIIT.
hmmm...I'm finding the girls that can really eat as much as they want are few and far between. Monitoring calorie balance is likely a necessity and I definitely plan on doing that for 10 days after my carb nite before switching to CBL. Is insanity all you're doing? Do you have access to a gym? I know you don't need to train on Carb nite, but I personally would be terribly unhappy not working out. At the very least, if I wasn't lifting and focused on pure fat loss, I would ensure to do hiit the two days immediately following carb nite, along with 2 half hour walks through the week. Also, maybe a short, full body resistance training session right before eating the carbs. How much are you eating? I think your maint. would be .8 grams to 1 gram of protein per lean body mass and fat to match. Carbs should be as close to zero as you can get them, allowing for up to 30, which ideally would be incidental (like maybe in cheese, etc). Is it that time of the month? I feel like ass about myself when I'm pms'ing. I'm going to visit my sis tomorrow who hasn't seen me since the day before I quit smoking so she will surely be able to tell if I look bigger...Everyone else says I'm being an idiot. 😛Hang in there. Keep doing what you're doing. make one small change at a time and monitor progress for at least a week. If you find it helped, great. If not, change another small thing and assess again. Don't quit though! This can obviously work, you just need to find how it will work for you!Lift some heavy weights - its very empowering!
I feel sort of the same way. If it's anything, I'm just impatient as hell. I've made progress, and I've went down in weight then when back up. I'm definitely leaner and stronger - but it still "seems" slow. I've tried tweaking the carb night program by watching and lowering calorie intake. I did this by lowering fat and increasing the length of my fasting window. Well, when I did this the headaches started coming back. I finally figured out that I need to eat pure fat to keep the headaches at bay.Someone suggested that I may not be fully fat adapted, which is why I'm having problems. If i'm not under 30g I'm not doing carb nite.If there is one thing for sure, I've never been over 60g of carbs on this diet for the past 33 days. I hope you're not talking about the ULC part of the day - you should always be as close to zero as possible! 30 is the recommended MAX amount of usable carbs for a day, and you shouldn't have more than ten in one meal if you wish to avoid an insulin spike! (which you should be avoiding during the ULC periods!)I also feel like giving up. DONT GIVE UP!!! but because I'm making progress, giving up is just being impatient. I really feel that if I try to lower my calorie intake and start introducing cardio my performance will suffer. You can lower your calorie intake (depending on what it currently is) without introducing cardio...Definitely don't do cardio!If I didn't care about my strength/muscle gain here is what I would do for weight loss:I would do 14-16 hour fasts. Doing heavy lifting fasted, taking luciene/BCAA pre/post workout. Do a post workout low carb meal with NO Protein shake.Twice a week I will do 2- 24 hour fasts. I'd line them up so that they fit with my off days.I would start doing cardio again (currently I'm not doing any) hiit 3-4 days a weekKeep carb intake under 100g a day.That's what I'm thinking of doing. In any case I'm giving carb nite another 30 days, but this time around I will be EVEN MORE NEUROTIC about my food tracking. I will also keep gluten to a minimum with carb nites. Do you have a log? Curious as to your stats and what your ULC days look like, what your carb nites look like and how you train. I sense a little confusion - and the parts that you seem to have wrong are the key factors in what makes this nutritional protocol work. Feel free to message me or help me find your log...Anyways, I'm just sharing in with your frustration.
Cookie I COMPLETELY understand you frustration. I'm a guy just for the record, but I've dieted down many times. This is my first go around at CN and personally, most of my frustration comes from the extremely poor compilation of easily and accurate information that Kiefer has failed to make readily available.But I digress, Despite what others have said, I've found, you do in fact need to run a deficit on this diet, there is no way around it. The whole point of CNS versus a traditional fat loss diet, is the higher fat intake, which helps elevate energy levels, helps prevent proteolysis, and helps assist in potential strength and/or muscle gain while losing fat. But you need a deficit, the key is not to go too much, but I will guarantee you that EVERYONE who loses significant amounts of weight on CNS whether they know it or not is in a deficit. They may think they are not, but they are. You give me 100 people who are stalled and following everything as outliend, and I will virtually guarantee that they are not in a deficit with everything else being equal.If you weight 141 lets just say you are 20-25% BF, if you could find out for sure or get a close estimate that would help. I suggest get some high quality body fat calipers and have a friend or family member take the measurements, it's really easy, and will give you a fairly accurate reading. No need to do all the expensive testing. I've found calipers get close enough, because I've compared both methods.So back to the numbers, if your 20-25% @ 141lbs, that would mean you have around 106-113lbs of lbm, So your protein should be no more than 113 grams per day, with you fat being equal or slightly less. So you total calories per day should exceed no more than 1500 calories per day. If you are truly eating 2500+ calories per day it's no wonder you feel fat. That is my maintainence and I'm a guy and weight 175 @ 15%BF.Regarding constipation, I had a huge problem with this too, and there were a lot of members who WRONGLY told me "I shouldn't be if I'm consuming enough fat." This is ludicrous, because a., I'm eating the amount of at prescribed in the diet 1:1 mostly saturated, so to eat more would send me over, and b. I have NEVER in my life been irregular unless I cut out carbs and/or fiberous veggies. I think who ever is perpetuating this nonsense that we should cut out fiberous veggies because of fear of insulin release needs to STOP. This is assanine, no one is going to get fat or stop burning fat because they ate broccoli, asparagus, spinach, mushrooms, kale, celary, cucumbers, even tomatoes in moderation, etc. I eat 3 meals per day and when I can, I eat a cup or two or more of fiberous veggies when I can, and since I have been doing this, I've been regular every day. No need to take fiber additives, like Metamucil or the like.Bottom line is a woman of your size is going to get fat eating the amount you've been eating.Regarding your Carb nights, I would suggest tailoring those back as well. My suggestion is limit it to 2-3 meals max, with modest fat. Meal 1. 2 brown spotted bananas, 40 grams protein blend, 1 cup blueberries, blend together and make a shake.Meal 2. 2 medium Baked Sweet Potoatoes and a couple pieces of roast chicken legs and thighs, slice of pecan pieMeal 3. 2 chocolate chip cookies, 8oz milkThat totals out to around 250-300g carbs MAX, with no more than 50-70 grams fat, 120-130 grams protein.If your eating 500+ carbs per load with loads of fat too boot, that is TOO much.I think personally people have twisted the whole concept of a carb load to turn it into a food free-for-all where counting calories gets thrown out the window. And the people that help perpetuate this idea are the guys with a ton of muscle mass, usually lower body fat, i.e. under 10-15%, who then tell every one how they ate two choclate cakes, quart of ice cream, large pizza and dropped 3% fat in a week. They are the 1%er's. Lets be honest here, especially with men, there is a huge amount of ego involved if a guy can eat 10,000 calories on a carb nite and drop fat, and look ripped then go around telling everyone to do the same because it worked for them. I mean hell, when I was a teenager I used to think following Dorian Yates diet and training program would make me big like him because it's what he said to do in all the mags. lol
I know you said you don't do dairy except maybe once a week with cream cheese. Don't even do that. I did the same thing and was stalling for weeks. I cut out the dairy and it took like a week but got back to normal. Now I am losing fat again. I always train real hard my carb nite, and then come home and go nuts. I am talking trashy foods. I always see people on here eating bananas, sweet potatoes, and rice. My carb nites are what I want. I eat pizza, ice cream, cherry turnovers, cookies, and doughnuts. Just keep tweaking it. And for the constapation just add more coconut oil….that outta clear you right up.
So back to the numbers, if your 20-25% @ 141lbs, that would mean you have around 106-113lbs of lbm, So your protein should be no more than 113 grams per day, with you fat being equal or slightly less. So you total calories per day should exceed no more than 1500 calories per day. If you are truly eating 2500+ calories per day it's no wonder you feel fat. That is my maintainence and I'm a guy and weight 175 @ 15%BF.
Hey Shokat, Thanks for the detailed response...Just wanted to touch on a couple things...up until I quit smoking, I had visible abs, and some visible separation in my quads - no where near 25% BF!...I was thinking more about 18-20 tops...I'm actually fairly lean with all my fat from the butt down (even my hips are lean/bony). I did the detox diet about 6 weeks ago, and roughly followed the model of protein:fat for my above projected BF numbers, and without checking 1600-1700 cals - I was so hungry mid-day at work that I started panicking during the second week...felt like I was going to pass out and needed to sit down for the rest of the day (I stand at work)...The panicking happened 3 days in a row. I'm super active and do some form of training every day (lift 4 times a week, hiit 3 times a week, along with conditioning work, random stretching, and yoga) - That 1500 cals a day model would basically mean I couldn't leave the house! Thinking I need to be closer to 2k, but definitely not 2500+ (which is to hunger - hahaha - so sick of hearing "just eat to hunger") I have a feeling I would do fine at 2k if I struggled through a couple days of it till I adjusted (buying calipers today)
Regarding your Carb nights, I would suggest tailoring those back as well. My suggestion is limit it to 2-3 meals max, with modest fat. Meal 1. 2 brown spotted bananas, 40 grams protein blend, 1 cup blueberries, blend together and make a shake.Meal 2. 2 medium Baked Sweet Potoatoes and a couple pieces of roast chicken legs and thighs, slice of pecan pieMeal 3. 2 chocolate chip cookies, 8oz milkThat totals out to around 250-300g carbs MAX, with no more than 50-70 grams fat, 120-130 grams protein.If your eating 500+ carbs per load with loads of fat too boot, that is TOO much.
I don't think the actual carb nite is a problem for me - it used to be - back when I kept the carbs under 300! I would wake up looking bloated and soft the next day. Since bumping it to 500, I look full and vascular. I probably only get 30 grams of fat during carb nite. I start the carb nite after squat day, with a shake made of dextrose & WPI, followed by gluten free fat free cereal and skim milk. If I eat an actual meal, it would be chicken and rice, other wise, more cereal, or low fat GF junk - liked baked sweet potato chips and salsa. I bake gluten free stuff and wrap the night up with that and up to a cup - 2 servings - ice cream...I'm gluten intolerant so everything is always gluten free - I don't eat like other people brag about, wish I could eat a half a pie or whole pizza
Regarding constipation, I had a huge problem with this too, and there were a lot of members who WRONGLY told me "I shouldn't be if I'm consuming enough fat." This is ludicrous, because a., I'm eating the amount of at prescribed in the diet 1:1 mostly saturated, so to eat more would send me over, and b. I have NEVER in my life been irregular unless I cut out carbs and/or fiberous veggies. I think who ever is perpetuating this nonsense that we should cut out fiberous veggies because of fear of insulin release needs to STOP. This is assanine, no one is going to get fat or stop burning fat because they ate broccoli, asparagus, spinach, mushrooms, kale, celary, cucumbers, even tomatoes in moderation, etc. I eat 3 meals per day and when I can, I eat a cup or two or more of fiberous veggies when I can, and since I have been doing this, I've been regular every day. No need to take fiber additives, like Metamucil or the like.
I really took this bad advice to heart over the past month or so. Super idiotic of me. I know I'm not going to gain by eating spinach peppers and onions 😮 !! Adding this stuff back in this week. Sick of walking around with a food baby.Anyway...Making the following changes this week, I know I should only be making 1 at a time, but switching to CBL after this next ten days, so everything MUST be in order before that! (also thinking I will finally be leveled out from quitting smoking)1. Ditching the HWC in my coffee 🙁 makes me really sad. I know I don't have an issue with dairy, doing it just to get rid of the liquid calories and fat. This will also help when I make the switch to CBL as the no coffee thing till the twelve hour mark was always a huge issue for me2. Dropping the calories. Gonna keep it to 2 on lifting days, and try real hard for 1800 on hiit days. 3. Adding fibrous veggies back in 4. Tomorrow (Sunday) is my last carb nite, before switching to a ten day prep for CBL. The first back load will be on a Wed, which works out perfectly with my lifting schedule (lifting week starts on Wed)...Also, I JUST started lifting at night, so excited to backload after lifting in the optimal training window. 5. For CBL, I will start my backload the same way I stat CN - with WPI & Dextrose, followed by lean protein and low fat or fat free starch, and small dessert (keeping carbs around 150 for lower body training and 130 for upper)Alright! Thanks again - I know my cals are higher than what you recommend, but how's the rest of my plan sound to you? Anything else you think I should do different?
Hey Zach, answered in red…
I know you said you don't do dairy except maybe once a week with cream cheese. Don't even do that. I did the same thing and was stalling for weeks. I cut out the dairy and it took like a week but got back to normal.I cut out all dairy except kerrygold butter to cook with for a little over a month and didn't see any changes. Added it back in and also didn't see any changes. I only skip it because I would rather load up on calories from meat. Fortunately, I am not one of those people that can't tolerate it. Now I am losing fat again. I always train real hard my carb nite, and then come home and go nuts. I am talking trashy foods. I always see people on here eating bananas, sweet potatoes, and rice. My carb nites are what I want. I eat pizza, ice cream, cherry turnovers, cookies, and doughnuts. Just keep tweaking it. I can't eat whatever I want. I have a severe intolerance to gluten, and suffer pretty bad if I don't make sure it's never included in my diet. Also, I'm kind of a health nut, so as much as pizza, turnovers, cookies and doughnuts are supposed to be "good", I am also interested in what's good for you or at least not detrimental....And for the constapation just add more coconut oil....that outta clear you right up. This just adds more calories and fat - taking away from actual solid food I can be eating. Also, I don't really like coconut oil. The most I care to ingest is 2 Tbsp a day - and that doesn't help, so back to the veggies it is!
Overtraining may be playing a factor, if you are lifting 4 days a week and HIIT 3 days a week. I know I have heard Kiefer talk about 1-2 HIIT sessions max while running CNS, usually timed the day after CNI feel your frustration, i have been stuck as well at wt and BF%. Over the last few weeks, i have cut back on my CN (200-300 grams, instead of 500-600 grams) AND cutback on training (lifting 2-3 week and 1 HIIT a week) and have seen progress on the scale and in how I feel
I have no idea then. You are so lucky you can have dairy lol. Kiefer mentioned something in his podcast about how people will hit a wall for a while and then all of a sudden weight comes flying off. You look pretty cut from your profile picture, and I know the thinner and more cut you are the longer and harder it is to get fat off.
That's what I'm thinking of doing. In any case I'm giving carb nite another 30 days, but this time around I will be EVEN MORE NEUROTIC about my food tracking. I will also keep gluten to a minimum with carb nites. Do you have a log? Curious as to your stats and what your ULC days look like, what your carb nites look like and how you train. I sense a little confusion - and the parts that you seem to have wrong are the key factors in what makes this nutritional protocol work. Feel free to message me or help me find your log...Anyways, I'm just sharing in with your frustration.
Thanks for extending out to assist me. All my logs I placed in my signature.
And in case you're using tapatalk here it isDH Forum Carb Nite Loghttp://goo.gl/M2dNIPhoto Food Journal Log (icloud)http://goo.gl/6wq0dLivestrong Food Journalhttp://goo.gl/W5XN8Workout Journal (Evernote & Fitocracy)http://goo.gl/HAehYhttps://www.fitocracy.com/entry/12711287/
So back to the numbers, if your 20-25% @ 141lbs, that would mean you have around 106-113lbs of lbm, So your protein should be no more than 113 grams per day, with you fat being equal or slightly less. So you total calories per day should exceed no more than 1500 calories per day. If you are truly eating 2500+ calories per day it's no wonder you feel fat. That is my maintainence and I'm a guy and weight 175 @ 15%BF.
Hey Shokat, Thanks for the detailed response...Just wanted to touch on a couple things...up until I quit smoking, I had visible abs, and some visible separation in my quads - no where near 25% BF!...I was thinking more about 18-20 tops...I'm actually fairly lean with all my fat from the butt down (even my hips are lean/bony). I did the detox diet about 6 weeks ago, and roughly followed the model of protein:fat for my above projected BF numbers, and without checking 1600-1700 cals - I was so hungry mid-day at work that I started panicking during the second week...felt like I was going to pass out and needed to sit down for the rest of the day (I stand at work)...The panicking happened 3 days in a row. I'm super active and do some form of training every day (lift 4 times a week, hiit 3 times a week, along with conditioning work, random stretching, and yoga) - That 1500 cals a day model would basically mean I couldn't leave the house! Thinking I need to be closer to 2k, but definitely not 2500+ (which is to hunger - hahaha - so sick of hearing "just eat to hunger") I have a feeling I would do fine at 2k if I struggled through a couple days of it till I adjusted (buying calipers today)
Regarding your Carb nights, I would suggest tailoring those back as well. My suggestion is limit it to 2-3 meals max, with modest fat. Meal 1. 2 brown spotted bananas, 40 grams protein blend, 1 cup blueberries, blend together and make a shake.Meal 2. 2 medium Baked Sweet Potoatoes and a couple pieces of roast chicken legs and thighs, slice of pecan pieMeal 3. 2 chocolate chip cookies, 8oz milkThat totals out to around 250-300g carbs MAX, with no more than 50-70 grams fat, 120-130 grams protein.If your eating 500+ carbs per load with loads of fat too boot, that is TOO much.
I don't think the actual carb nite is a problem for me - it used to be - back when I kept the carbs under 300! I would wake up looking bloated and soft the next day. Since bumping it to 500, I look full and vascular. I probably only get 30 grams of fat during carb nite. I start the carb nite after squat day, with a shake made of dextrose & WPI, followed by gluten free fat free cereal and skim milk. If I eat an actual meal, it would be chicken and rice, other wise, more cereal, or low fat GF junk - liked baked sweet potato chips and salsa. I bake gluten free stuff and wrap the night up with that and up to a cup - 2 servings - ice cream...I'm gluten intolerant so everything is always gluten free - I don't eat like other people brag about, wish I could eat a half a pie or whole pizza
Regarding constipation, I had a huge problem with this too, and there were a lot of members who WRONGLY told me "I shouldn't be if I'm consuming enough fat." This is ludicrous, because a., I'm eating the amount of at prescribed in the diet 1:1 mostly saturated, so to eat more would send me over, and b. I have NEVER in my life been irregular unless I cut out carbs and/or fiberous veggies. I think who ever is perpetuating this nonsense that we should cut out fiberous veggies because of fear of insulin release needs to STOP. This is assanine, no one is going to get fat or stop burning fat because they ate broccoli, asparagus, spinach, mushrooms, kale, celary, cucumbers, even tomatoes in moderation, etc. I eat 3 meals per day and when I can, I eat a cup or two or more of fiberous veggies when I can, and since I have been doing this, I've been regular every day. No need to take fiber additives, like Metamucil or the like.
I really took this bad advice to heart over the past month or so. Super idiotic of me. I know I'm not going to gain by eating spinach peppers and onions 😮 !! Adding this stuff back in this week. Sick of walking around with a food baby.Anyway...Making the following changes this week, I know I should only be making 1 at a time, but switching to CBL after this next ten days, so everything MUST be in order before that! (also thinking I will finally be leveled out from quitting smoking)1. Ditching the HWC in my coffee 🙁 makes me really sad. I know I don't have an issue with dairy, doing it just to get rid of the liquid calories and fat. This will also help when I make the switch to CBL as the no coffee thing till the twelve hour mark was always a huge issue for me2. Dropping the calories. Gonna keep it to 2 on lifting days, and try real hard for 1800 on hiit days. 3. Adding fibrous veggies back in 4. Tomorrow (Sunday) is my last carb nite, before switching to a ten day prep for CBL. The first back load will be on a Wed, which works out perfectly with my lifting schedule (lifting week starts on Wed)...Also, I JUST started lifting at night, so excited to backload after lifting in the optimal training window. 5. For CBL, I will start my backload the same way I stat CN - with WPI & Dextrose, followed by lean protein and low fat or fat free starch, and small dessert (keeping carbs around 150 for lower body training and 130 for upper)Alright! Thanks again - I know my cals are higher than what you recommend, but how's the rest of my plan sound to you? Anything else you think I should do different?
Based on what you stated I think you are on the right track. Obviously Im flying blind trying to guess your BF% so you would know better than me. I do agree with Dr. Patel that you might be over training, it only takes 1 or 2 extra work out days to really send your CNS into over drive especially when dieting. I would say cut back on one or 2 days of the HIIT and and see how that helps.And you know you body better than I do, you are right maybe 1500kc maybe too low, so try 2000kc per day and see how that workds. I agree with Zach that the leaner you are the harder it is drop fat. Here is how I think of it, Imagine you are aiming at a bulls eye target but you cannot see the bulls eye just around the bulls eye, the only way you'll know you hit the bulls eye is when you reach your goal, but until you can only aim for it blindly by seeing the rings around the bulls eye. So just imagine the more you learn by trial and error the more you are getting closer and closer to the center. If you let the frustration get to you will begin to shoot wildly and begin to even shoot off the target completley. So DO NOT give up you are closer to your goal than you realize, it's just going to take some more refinement and learning process. Kiefer said it himself, "the fat didn't come on over night, so don't expect it come off over night." I would say for the carb nites keep them to a point where over several weeks you can track the food intake, so that you can add or subtract if needed and be able to determine if more or less is needed. I think the people who just stuff food down their gullet without any idea of how much or what they are eating have no weigh accurately determining if they need to add or subtract something because they cannot quantify it.
Whoa! Lotsa replies!!! I will try hard to get back to them all tonight, but running around (weekends are so crazy!!)
Overtraining may be playing a factor, if you are lifting 4 days a week and HIIT 3 days a week. I know I have heard Kiefer talk about 1-2 HIIT sessions max while running CNS, usually timed the day after CNI feel your frustration, i have been stuck as well at wt and BF%. Over the last few weeks, i have cut back on my CN (200-300 grams, instead of 500-600 grams) AND cutback on training (lifting 2-3 week and 1 HIIT a week) and have seen progress on the scale and in how I feel
YES! It was mostly due to carb nite concern, but since I am dropping it, no need for those 2 hiit days back to back after carb nite. Was talking with my hubby and he agreed, so I will be taking 2 rest days a week, starting ASAP
whoa whoa whoa…..So got me some fat calipers today. Nothing fancy. Tested according to the instructions on just one site (suprailliac fold) – got 19%…Tested again after getting settled, 7 sites – got 15.8%…Plugged all the data into exrx.net and followed there instructions for taking the measurements…Too bad the butt area is not included as a standard place to take measurements because I am fairly certain I carry at least 5 pounds right there 😛I have a minor issue...hoping to get some advice, but will likely need to start new post. I fell about 5 days ago and landed on my side (ribs)...They've been pretty sore. What should I not be doing? Do I ice them? No bruising or anything, but there have been things I can't do. Really don't want to not get any activity at all.
Cookie as long as you measure consistently the same places every time that should give you pretty accurate results as far as fat loss goes. I think anything under 20% for women is starting to get fairly lean, and w/ your activity level you could really benefit from cbl sa. sucks about your ribs, you can try alternating ice/heating pad, take some ibprofen see if that helps. you might have just bruised them internally, hopefully nothing more serious than that!
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