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All very interesting 🙂 I will be taking 30 g after each workout 4x a week. Simplest approach.
That's what I got out of it too.From the article:
Creatine taken at the same time as caffeine, in the absence of carbs, can actually prevent a rise in intracellular creatine levels[28, 64].
Very surprising to me given Kiefer's previous recommendations. I suppose he certainly does reserve the right to change his mind and new research is uncovered. Again, great article.
So does this mean creatine should be out for CNS folks, except on the actual Carb Nite?Edit: Maybe not, looks like there's benefit if you're training.
But what sounds weird to me is that caffeine prevents GLUT4 activation.. I'm not into CBL but isn't that a main part of CBL and caffeine is used as a booster for workouts? :>
I think, what he's thinking is that since insulin may aid the translocation of creatine into muscle cells, by having the caffeine you're lowering your rate of absorption.
Yeah, wow, the no caffeine rule makes it a trade-off with the caffeine in the post workout Hypertrophic Potentiator shake. At least I've only been wasting 5 grams at a time.Seems like the best strategy would be to eliminate caffeine from the post workout shake and load it with creatine instead. Training 3 days a week puts me around 45 grams of creatine per shake. Not sure if my digestive tract can handle that much.
Alright folks, here's what I got from it. It's stupid simple…For those who are doing CBL SA or DB, use creatine with the PWO Shake and during a Carb meal. For those who are doing CNS, on your Carb Nite, if you train right before the re-feed have a PWO Shake that contains creatine, you can also sip of creatine with the 10g hyrdolysates and 3-5g leucine with a carb meal. Just like for the folks doing CBL. *Also seems like the large dose with a ULC PWO Shake is still recommended tooYes this may be contradicting from the CBL book Kiefer came out with a little over a YEAR ago, just like new information and research came out for Carb Nite Solution (published many YEARS ago), new information and research comes out almost daily. So if you do with what is up-to-date you'll be fine and good to go
Yeah, wow, the no caffeine rule makes it a trade-off with the caffeine in the post workout Hypertrophic Potentiator shake. At least I've only been wasting 5 grams at a time.Seems like the best strategy would be to eliminate caffeine from the post workout shake and load it with creatine instead. Training 3 days a week puts me around 45 grams of creatine per shake. Not sure if my digestive tract can handle that much.
If you are taking carbs in, caffeine is fine with creatine.
Yeah, wow, the no caffeine rule makes it a trade-off with the caffeine in the post workout Hypertrophic Potentiator shake. At least I've only been wasting 5 grams at a time.Seems like the best strategy would be to eliminate caffeine from the post workout shake and load it with creatine instead. Training 3 days a week puts me around 45 grams of creatine per shake. Not sure if my digestive tract can handle that much.
If you are taking carbs in, caffeine is fine with creatine.
Training causes a non-insulin meditated translocation of tglut.The reason for no caffeine and creatine is caffeine decreases insulin sensitivity so it harder to translocated the glut transporters with just insulin.
So according to the article I'd have to be getting a little more than 27grams a day. Seems like a lot of creatine!
So how long do y'all think is a good period between caffeine intake prior or post to creatine dosing? Obviously one can't wait for it to totally wash out, but say you take caffeine 1/2 hour PrWO, then take the Creatine PoWO say, two hours later? Enough time? Honestly, I think we are hard-pressed to find ANYONE not taking some form of caffeine PrWO...Conversely, say I take the Creatine PoWO, how long should I wait to have some coffee?Thanks!
If I go by Kiefer's estimation, I would need to take 50-55g of creatine a day! Surely there is a cap where it becomes unnecessary to take so much.Ideas?
So how long do y'all think is a good period between caffeine intake prior or post to creatine dosing? Obviously one can't wait for it to totally wash out, but say you take caffeine 1/2 hour PrWO, then take the Creatine PoWO say, two hours later? Enough time? Honestly, I think we are hard-pressed to find ANYONE not taking some form of caffeine PrWO...Conversely, say I take the Creatine PoWO, how long should I wait to have some coffee?Thanks!
I dont think its going to matter too much. You have different forms of mediated action here. If one is downregulated (Glut4 from caffiene Pre-Workout) the other is still available (insulin via carbs Post-Workout) So basically if youre on CBL taking creatine Post-Workout is your best option because of the carbs/insulin and Glut4 Stimulation from training. And likewise if youre on CNS you are best served taking creatine Post-Workout because of the Glut4 Stimulation.
I dont think its going to matter too much. You have different forms of mediated action here. If one is downregulated (Glut4 from caffiene Pre-Workout) the other is still available (insulin via carbs Post-Workout) So basically if youre on CBL taking creatine Post-Workout is your best option because of the carbs/insulin and Glut4 Stimulation from training. And likewise if youre on CNS you are best served taking creatine Post-Workout because of the Glut4 Stimulation.
Thanks. So then the time lapse is enough so that the caffeine still in my system from PrWO is not enough 2-2 1/2 hours later to interfere with the Creatine uptake due to Glut-4 stimulation PoWO, correct? (I am running CNS)
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